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Fitz’s Knuckle Ball | 39 comments (35 topical, 4 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Fitz's Knuckle Ball (4.00 / 2)

Interesting... but is it the espionage act that he lays out the case for... or is it a conspiracy case given all the titles and "lettered" officials mentioned?

Or both?

It seems clear to me that the paragraphs in question (Josh Marshall has been questioning them as well) regarding the Norfolks plane flight are there to show that there were multiple players involved... including, most likely, the Vice President.

The paragraph wherein Libby tells his subordinate that there are complications in using the Plame/CIA information shows that he knew that this was classified information.

Can anyone confirm who the under secretary of state is? I have heard both Marc Grossman (Billmon writes as if there is no question it is him) and John Bolton mentioned as most likely. Bolton makes a lot of sense but I've seen no evidence for either. Does anyone have real evidence?

The 10,000 Things

by Andrew C White (acwhite.nospam.@taconic.net) on Sat Oct 29th, 2005 at 09:06:44 PM EST

Re: Fitz's Knuckle Ball (4.00 / 2)

Steve Clemons believes it's Grossman:

<snip>

The Undersecretary of State referenced in the indictment is not John Bolton -- it is Marc Grossman, the former U/S for Political Affairs. Because Powell and Armitage were out of the country at the time, Grossman was Acting Sec State. Hence, the State Department's INR forwarded Grossman the memo on the Niger stuff and Plame and Wilson's role, and Grossman forwarded it on to the White House. Nothing sinister -- Grossman was just peforming his bureaucratic function.

</snip>

There are LIVES in the balance. Click here. Watch. Listen.

by cotterperson on Sat Oct 29th, 2005 at 09:22:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Fitz's Knuckle Ball (none / 1)

Thanks. That makes sense... although Bolton was dealing with WMD's in his role so it would not have been nefarious for him to know about Plame or about Wilson's trip either. So it could still be either but it makes sense that it would be Grossman in that context.

The 10,000 Things

by Andrew C White (acwhite.nospam.@taconic.net) on Sat Oct 29th, 2005 at 09:40:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Fitz's Knuckle Ball (4.00 / 2)

Andrew, Larry Johnson wrote in his story yesterday that it's either Marc Grossman or John Bolton.

I looked up Grossman. Guess who he works with these days. William Cohen, in The Cohen Group.

Re the specific acts, that's how i first encountered Marty's writing. On October 21` -- god, that seems like a year ago! -- I wrote "Fitz's Targets: They Who Reveal National Security Secrets" and used Marty's excellent piece in the Memphis Flyer:

Marty Aussenberg of the weekly Memphis Flyer has handicapped the "Plame Game." The 1982 act is a "longshot," but he gives "better than even" odds that the 1917 Espionate Act will be used. ...

Beyond handicapping the game, he explains each act very clearly. It's a wonderful, concise reference.

Hickok: "You know the sound of thunder. Can you imagine that sound if I ask you to? Ma'am, listen to the thunder."

by susanhu (susanhuatearthlinkdotnet) on Sat Oct 29th, 2005 at 09:24:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Fitz's Knuckle Ball (none / 0)

Cohen. Geebus! These guys really do run like a greek not-so-secret society. Next thing someone will be telling us is that the warden at the prison some of these schmucks ought to be going to is the old room mate and pledge brother of Bolton! LOL

I agree that it seemed clear that he laid the case for espionage in the indictment but it also seems clear that he was showing a pretty tight circle of titles and names that would lead to conspiracy charges. The discussion aboard the airplane really runs in that direction. Cheney is not named (here but apparently he was in previous newspaper articles specifically in the context of that flight) but a group of people discussed the course of action to take and then Libby took it. That is the groundwork for conspiracy and the admonition to the underling not to use the information shows knowledge that the info was classified and that all adds up to premeditation.

The 10,000 Things

by Andrew C White (acwhite.nospam.@taconic.net) on Sat Oct 29th, 2005 at 09:38:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Fitz’s Knuckle Ball | 39 comments (35 topical, 4 editorial, 0 hidden)

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