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Fight for Your Rights: Call Obama on FISA | 27 comments (27 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Fight for Your Rights: Call Obama on FISA (none / 0)

You give me a break. Are you really so naive to think that protecting the 4th Amendment is a small issue that he should only devote seconds on? Plus, this has been going on for years, it didn't just happen today. He and his colleagues have had a long time to think about this. The facts are clear and not in dispute. You have to be a fool not to see the importance of illegal warrantless spying on the American people.

It's obvious to those of us that didn't fall prey to the cult of Obama (cough, cough) that he is a normal politician. I am all for pressuring him. I have been. I supported him reluctantly. He was my 3rd choice. I am willing to be his ally if he simply does the minimum to defend the constitution--which means no illegal warrantless spying. It's a pretty simple construct that patriots throughout this country's history have understood. It's evidently lost on Obamabots.

I gave Obama the benefit of the doubt. You would have to be a fool to still be peering into Obama's soul and to somehow think that he make it a priority to protect the 4th amendment and our other liberties. I hope this pressure works. But make no mistake about it; Obama is no patriot and will only do the right thing on our core liberties if pressured to do so. This changes everything. Obama is no longer an dependable ally he needs to be watched like a Clinton or a Lieberman.

You (and Booman and other "liberals") have given Obama a free pass so yet again another Democrat feels free to piss all over our core liberal positions. I'm for any politician that will stand up to this tyranny. You are for tyranny. You're naive.

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 04:04:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Get real (none / 1)

Don't presume what you don't know. Everyone doesn't email a copy of everything that happens in DC to you. How do you know that Obama hasn't privately gone to Hoyer and asked him to drop the compromise and Hoyer said no? In fact, Obama doesn't even need to. Hoyer already knows what Obama's position is. So Hoyer is going forward in opposition to Obama. What gives Hoyer the power to do so?

What should Obama do? Have Hoyer arrested? Embarrass him? And then what happens when Hoyer gives a hearty FU to Obama and pushes the legislation anyway? Much of what is politics is the appearance of power. Obama is not very powerful yet. Remember, two weeks ago he won the closest primary in U.S. history. The DLC could still make things uncomfortable for Obama between now and the convention, and then through November.

I think it's all well and good to let Obama know what you want and let everyone in Congress know what you want. But please have some kind of sense about who has what power. That's why I reprinted that quote by Jim Garrison earlier today. The reason why Congress has been bending over for the spy agencies and their allies for decades is because the spy agencies HAVE MORE POWER THAN CONGRESS. That's the way it is. That's why the Steny Hoyers exist.

Why not call the political opposition in Zimbabwe wusses? They're afraid to campaign. They don't have enough poll workers. They must be wusses. Get it?

by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:43:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get real (none / 1)

Yes. It all may be futile and the Steny Hoyers and the Obamas may be beholden to certain powers (and thanks for the Garrison piece). But the only chance we have of making Obama beholden to us instead of these powers is by exercising democratic influence over him. When it comes down to it--it is up to us to punish our politicians for these gross violations of our civil liberties. And quess what? I just found out that my only hope of salvaging some form of justice just died because Mr. Obama has a busy schedule. He can't be bothered to fight for the 4th Amendment. His brainiac advisers say that would make him look "weak" .

And really, this is about old-fashioned politics. You bang heads. I thought Obama's people were going around bragging about how its Obama's party now? What happened to that? Obama is already making big changes within the party, people like Booman inform us. Didn't Obama just put a chief of staff in for his future V.P. choice? That seems like a creative use of his power to send a message to his party. How about he use some creative thinking to figure out a way to punish those in the party want to erase the 4th Amendment because Georgie Bush will call them names unless they do?

Oh, here's a hint on where Obama can start. He can NOT film a spot endorsing one of the Blue Dogs that is fighting for the Bush and Cheney FISA bill. That's one subtle way he could put pressure on his party to not cave in on this. He can also come out forcefully today and condemn this measure--for starters.

He can do a lot. But I suspect that most Democratic partisans will instead focus their creative energies on making us all forget this traitorous act.

And btw, that's not fair to the opposition in Zimbabwe to even mention the Democratic party in the same sentence. They have politicians risking their lives to fight for their freedoms . . . all we got is these rats.

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 07:19:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get real (none / 1)

SF Hawkguy, it's absolutely fair to compare Zimbabwe to the U.S. The difference that the power is less easily seen here.

Like I keep saying, until you recognize who has what power, trying to blame Obama for stopping what he may not be able to stop is premature. Do I wish that all DLC Democrats and assclown conservatives disappeared from the Democratic Party and were replaced by liberals and progressives? Of course. It's just not going to happen because Obama looks to get the nomination.

As an aside, if Obama keeps to his word and has his people do investigations after taking office he can look into what's been going on. He can work to stop this illegal spying. But if he doesn't win in November then it's up to John McCain. BOHICA.

by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 09:25:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Fight for Your Rights: Call Obama on FISA | 27 comments (27 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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