Who "we" Susan D?

Howard Dean made a mistake.

I thought so when he did it, and the results are proving me correct.

Log rolling by corporate-owned interests within the Democratic Party push it closer and closer towards the center.

Meanwhile, the Republicans continue to succeed in pushing that "center" further and further to the right.

Democrats at the "grassroots" level?

Don't make me laugh.

Mind the steamroller.

AIN'T no "grassroots" after 10 tons of money roll you over.

Just a vacant lot.

"...working hard this cycle to prove that WE are more important than the Harold Ickes of the world."

If the Harold Ickes of this world...second generation political hustlers with the skills AND the money to do their job (You DO know that Harold Ickes Sr. was FDR's Haldeman, don't you?)...own the party, then "we" are NOT more important than they are.

"...more important than the Harold Ickes of the world"?

Define your use of the term "the world".

The DemocRatpublican Party IS "the world" as far as they are concerned. And they own it. Lock, stock and barrel.

Sorry, SusanD. If you want to kick the PermaGov out, the very FIRST thing you have to do is start a party that is not OWNED by said PermaGov.

Then the second thing you have to do is to ensure that it cannot be bought by them.

Then and only then will you have a shot...an outside shot but what the hell, it's certainly better than THIS shit...at whuppn' 'em.

A coalition of minorities, the working class in general, the regular "liberal" left  and women who are dissatisfied with their lot in life.

EASILY a third of the population.

Let the Ratpublicans and the DemocRatpublicans split the other two thirds and hope that there are enough people who are sickened by what is going on in both parties to give you a majority.

The only way...

Sorry, SusanD. You won't see me at ANY party meetings if that party is run by the same people who foisted the Boston convention and John (Small K) kerry on us.

You;re going to have to learn the hard way, I guess.

As if what has happened over the last 60+ years hasn't been hard enough.

It is THEIR party. HAS been since JFK was shot.

LBJ lives.

The Texas DemocRatpublican Party.

A class act for over 60 years.

Get real.

Good luck...

AG

Goodness had nothing to do with it, dearie.-Mae West

For example, people who are receiving a benefit, psychological or otherwise, from corporate rule, will see their best interests, and the country's, in a different way from those who are not receiving that benefit.

It is not realistic to expect to change the mind of someone who sees "the country" as the politicians and their corporate sponsors.

Neither party has a need for rejectionists and obstructionists who put their own selfish interests above those of the corporations and their politicians.

People who see "the country" as including women, including poor women, poor men, poor children, poor elders, gay people and ethnic minorities, people who are strongly opposed to crimes against humanity, for example, are likely to be opposed to US policies on principle, and not at all likely to be much help to the cause of implementing them more efficiently or presenting them in a more palatable way.

Neither party needs such people, their grandfathers were told "not yet," and so you have 3 or 4 generations of obstructionists and rejectionists who have nothing to offer either party, which actually works out because neither party has anything to offer them.

The parties can be counted on to do what it is in their best interests, they have proven that without any room for doubt!

The obstructionists and rejectionists may not have such an impressive track record, but I believe that they also can be counted on to do what is in the best interest of the country, according to what they perceive "country" to mean.

Both parties should carry on and not worry about them. Most of them don't even have any money.

one man's conspiracy is another man's business plan
Blog updated as needed

AG

Goodness had nothing to do with it, dearie.-Mae West

It is like being pretty effectively muzzled.  There is no media speaking for us, the only ones on TV much anymore are the usual suspects from the defunct Crossfire.   They all sound appropriately cautious and make sure to say nothing out of line.  

Trying not to say too much right now.  Pretty upset about Ickes doing this.