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The Quotable Bob Casey Jr.

by jpol
Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 06:32:20 PM EST

When I attended the Pennsylvania State Democratic Party Endorsement Convention last weekend (March 24-25, 2006) in Grantville, Pa. I was astonished to hear Bob Casey Jr. repeatedly referred to as a moderate Democrat. Casey supporter after Casey supporter I spoke with displayed an abysmal ignorance about how similar Bob Casey Jr. and Rick Santorum are on a host of critical social issues. Many reacted angrily when told about his stand on the Schiavo case, the war in Iraq, the Patriot Act, his ambiguous stand on civil unions, the role of religion in government, Roe v Wade, warrantless wiretaps, et al, often claiming that Casey’s positions on those and other issues are being grossly misrepresented.

And so, ladies and gentlemen, I bring you Bob Casey Jr. in his own words:

Bob Casey Jr. on Stem Cell research:

“I support the current federal policy on embryonic stem cell research and would oppose the Castle bill to expand federal support of embryonic stem cell research.”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on the influence of religion on his role as a public official:

“My Catholic faith and the values reflected in that faith have always had a profound impact on me as a person and as a public official. I try to live up to the teachings of my faith in my personal life and in my public life. “
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on abortion rights:

“As a pro-life Democrat, I have a different position on abortion than many national elected officials and that’s why an organization like NARAL won’t support me in the campaign.”
citation
“Most American people recognize [the right to privacy] to some degree or another, and I think that some privacy-related court decisions… are correct. But let me add that I do draw a line. The right to privacy does not trump the right of the unborn.”
"You can’t say you have a position I have and not believe that [Roe v Wade should be overturned].” "You can't have it both ways and say, 'I am pro-choice but,' or 'I am pro-life but."
citation
Lancaster County Action Questionnaire asked whether Casey supported a woman's “right to abortion.” He responded: “Oppose.”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on Equal Rights for Homosexuals:

“I don’t support gay marriage, but I also don’t support a constitutional amendment banning it. That would be tremendously divisive. However, I do support same sex unions that would give gay couples all the rights, privileges and protections of marriage.”
citation
But he responded differently to a Questionnaire that asked: What is your position on government requiring that benefits be provided to same sex partners?
Casey’s response: “Oppose”
citation
Questionnaire: What is your position on legislation allowing homosexuals to adopt children?
Casey’s response: “Oppose”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on the Iraq War:

“I don’t think we were intentionally mislead [in the runup to the war in Iraq].”
citation
“I don’t think you can, as a matter of policy, articulate a long-term strategy if you don’t have the facts to make that determination.”
citation
"Once [Iraq] was underway, like a lot of Americans, I was supportive of what our troops were trying to do there, based on what we were told by our government. We found out later the intelligence was, at best, faulty and, at worst, misleading. We can learn a lot of lessons from that, but the key thing now is to finish the job."
citation
“Some people think that pulling out is a good idea and a timeline is a good idea -- I don't agree with that.”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on Congressional intervention in the Terry Schiavo Case:

"I think you should err on the side of life. I think some kind of congressional review was appropriate."
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on Display of The Ten Commandments in government buildings:

“I don't oppose [such displays]. I do think politicians spend a lot more time talking about that question than trying to live the 10 Comandments. No matter what your religious beliefs, there are some universal truths in those commandments that we all ought to live by."
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on the Death Penalty:

Questionnaire: What is your position on repealing the death penalty in Pennsylvania?
Casey’s Answer: “Oppose”
citation
“I believe that the death penalty is an appropriate punishment for those who have committed heinous crimes.”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on Gun Control:

“I've been a strong supporter of the second amendment, the right to bear arms. That's evidenced not just by what I've said but the support I've gotten over the last decade from sportsmen's groups, including the NRA."
citation
“I don't think [the people of Pennsylvania] want battles to take place on a whole list of laws and regulations that impact gun owners and the right to bear arms."
citation
"Casey is not only not with us on this stuff, but he's a little bit hostile," said Peter Hamm of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on the Patriot Act:

“The agreement on the PATRIOT Act reauthorization is a victory in the war on terror and a triumph of bipartisanship. This agreement should clear the way for the renewal of this vital law and will continue to give law enforcement the tools that they need to target terrorists and prevent another terrorist attack. We cannot let the PATRIOT Act expire and we cannot give the terrorists an opening to plan another attack. I am pleased that the reauthorization addressed some of the issues regarding the protection of the rights of Americans.”
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on the nomination of Samuel Alito to the Supreme Court:

"the arguments against Judge Alito do not rise to the level that would require a vote denying him a seat on the U.S. Supreme Court."
citation

Bob Casey Jr. on warrantless NSA Wiretaps:

“I think we should be making sure we give law enforcement and federal agents the tools they need to fight terrorism."
citation
And on their legality:
"Well, that is a judgment that lawyers are going to make," said Casey, a lawyer
citation

Bob Casey Jr. On universal health care:

Sorry! Bob Casey’s silence is deafening on this issue. The single page on his web site devoted to issues does not contain a single word about health care.

And now you know why I plan to vote for Chuck Pennacchio in the May 16th state primary (where the voters will pick the nominee, much to the chagrin of the DSCC), and why I will never vote for Bob Casey Jr.

The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. | 89 comments (89 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 10)

Great summary.

Many Casey supporters have been reduced to arguing that the only thing that matters is getting a Dem majority in the Senate. But some of the Casey apologists over at Kos still insist Casey is progressive on economic issues.

But he isn't. Casey supports a small increase in the min. wage, but not a living wage (now even Santorum supports a small increase). He doesn't support universal healthcare. He supports anti-labor judges like Alito!

To his credit, Casey opposes social security privitization and "free trade", but simply opposing right-wing policies doesn't make you progressive. Casey has no plan to preserve SS for future generations. Chuck said part of the solution is raising Social Security payroll cap to $110,000 or $120,000. And by creating a living wage, the increased salary would boost the amount of payroll taxes flowing into the Social Security Trust Fund. The higher salaries that businesses would have to pay would be offset by a universal federal health-care plan that takes health-care costs out of employer's hands, he said.

I have never before seen a candidate who had such a great understanding of the issues and how they must viewed holistically, rather than in isolation.

by DaveyD (dave4sale@yahoo.com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 06:54:56 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 2)

Chuck said part of the solution is raising Social Security payroll cap to $110,000 or $120,000. And by creating a living wage, the increased salary would boost the amount of payroll taxes flowing into the Social Security Trust Fund. The higher salaries that businesses would have to pay would be offset by a universal federal health-care plan that takes health-care costs out of employer's hands, he said.

I have never before seen a candidate who had such a great understanding of the issues and how they must viewed holistically, rather than in isolation.

That almost sounds like it might actually work???

It would be interesting to hear the opinions on this from the "bondaddy" types that blog around the net...

This Casey guy sounds like a DOH LIEberman on religious steroids! How farrrr right wing and how much of a bush-kiss-ass can you be and NOT be a member of the GOP?

Support BooTrib

by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 08:17:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 7)

Good for you!!!! These repugnant lite dems need to be thrown out of the pary!!!!!

Doing My Part For The Left

by refinish69 (refinish69 at gmail dot com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 07:36:34 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 3)

Excellent work, jpol. Just brilliant.

No more Me-Too Dems!

by eRobin (eRobin@gmail.com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 08:15:58 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 5)

Thanks eRobin, and you too DaveyD and refinish69.

jpol

by jpol on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 08:19:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 3)

Wow! Casey is not in any way shape or form a D. What an amazing diary jpol.

Frodo failed...Bush has got the ring.

by alohaleezy on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 08:30:37 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 4)

Bob Casey's position on pretty much everything, summarized:

"I have a bigger tonker than Santorum or Pennacchio. Vote for me and my bigger tonker. Don't ask why, just do it!"

Kill because somebody was killed. Get killed because he killed. Do you think peace will ever come like that?

by Egarwaen on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 08:40:15 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 7)

I was writing a very long post that took objection to this, because as a Catholic Democrat lawyer from Maryland, I've always thought I agreed with Casey on most issues. The more I read, as I examined the citations, the more my opinion collapsed. So I nuked my post and change my mind.

This is an example of reading on the Internet and actually changing one's mind.

So thanks for the post.

I was really shocked to see how . . . REPUBLICAN . . . he is on civil rights.

by Arminius on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 09:06:49 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 5)

Thank you so much for this comment.

I've been thinking about pulling together these quotes for some time because I am frequently accused by Casey supporters of distorting his positions. It is gratifying to know that putting these quotes in front of people like you can actually change minds.

I think it is crucially important that we defeat Casey in the primary because I think Santorum will crush him in November if Casey is the candidate. There is no doubt that Santorum will spend lots of money to make sure every Pennsylvanian knows how conservative Casey is because Santorum's right-wing base will remain loyal to him while progressives and pro-choicers will stay home in droves once they realize where Bob Casey is coming from.

jpol

by jpol on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 10:16:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 4)

I think the key to the inevitable Casey loss is that nobody can trust him. The Dems certainly won't and the Republicans he so clearly covets believe that he'll vote with the Dems "when it matters." That "when it matters" comes straight from Rendell's mouth. Plus the Republicans already have someone to vote for. Someone who isn't doing a bad job as far as they're concerned.

I've heard that the grand Dem strategy is to win Pittsburgh and Philly and lose in the T by as little as possible. If Casey is the nominee (heaven forfend), when he loses, we should publicize that strategy until everyone associated with it loses their job.

No more Me-Too Dems!

by eRobin (eRobin@gmail.com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 10:42:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 5)

Just remember, there is usually only about a 15% turnout in primary elections. If we can energise people to vote for Chuck Pennacchio we can win this thing. Casey's edge over Santorum is down to 8-points in the latest Zogby poll. The more people learn about him the more his numbers tumble. A Casey victory in May will doom us to six more years of Santorum.

Over 6,000 volunteers have signed up at Chuck's web site, and the number grows every day. Just because the media and the pollsters pretend that the primary is a meaningless formality doesn't make it so.

jpol

by jpol on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 11:12:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 4)

I'm glad you took the time to read through the entire diary to see just how out of wack this "D" is. It's just absolutely insane. I don't understand how people can apologize over and over for his stances.

I argue with apologists all the time. I keep on making point after point. It really is like talking to a brick wall sometimes. But reading your comment, it makes me hope...

I've been educating voters for some time now in PA. It's a slow process, but the internet is invaluable in reaching many people at a time.

Once again, thank you for reading the entire diary and examining his stances on the issues!

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 11:07:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 3)

Good to see someone who is open to persuasion, Arminius!

by canberra boy (canberraboy1 at gmail dot com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 06:44:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Bob Casey Jr. on Drugs (4.00 / 3)

From Citypaper, May 9, 2002

HA: All right. Is there any room in the Casey administration for the legalization of drugs in any way?
BC: No.
HA: Have you ever smoked marijuana?
BC: No.

I'm running for the US Senate again, Wisconsin 2012.

by ben masel (bDESPAMmasel@tds.net) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 09:49:14 PM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 4)

Incredible work jpol. The Casey website "Issues" section is such a pathetic sham. Stealth campaign.

GO CHUCK!!!!

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 11:11:54 PM EST

Have some fun with this (4.00 / 6)

Put together a little flyer that takes the form of a quiz. Select a few of the better quotes, then print each quote, followed by a box that says:

Who said this?
[_] Rick Santorum [_] Bob Casey Jr.

Preferably the quotes will all be similar to statements made by Santorum.

Then distribute this to Casey supporters and watch their heads spin.

I for one welcome our new Twitter overlords. @Omir55

by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Sun Apr 2nd, 2006 at 11:36:05 PM EST

Question (4.00 / 2)

Assuming Casey wins the primary, who would you rather see in the Senate from PA for the next six years - Casey or Santorum?

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 09:35:48 AM EST

Re: Question (4.00 / 3)

For me that is not a choice. I would never vote for any candidate whose positions I viscerally disagree with, so I would not vote for either Casey or Santorum.

I will say this though. If there is anything worse than a Republican wingnut it is a Democrat who votes like one. One Joe Lieberman in the Senate is quite enough, thank you.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 09:50:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 1)

Well that says it all then. You'd rather see Santorum in the Senate than Casey because not voting for either - that is, not voting for Casey - helps to guarantee Santorum's re-election. Another case of I'll-hold-my-breath-'til-I-turn-blue politics. As for myself, I'd rather have a Dem majority than a tantrum.

But, hey, you'll be in good company with all those who voted for Nader in Florida in 2000. Maybe if you write in Pennachio in November you could feel even more self-righteous while you watch the Republicans control the government for a few more years. That'll teach us practical ones.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:34:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

Riiiiight, blame the people who voted for Nader in 2000 instead of Gore for running a SHITTY EXCUSE FOR A CAMPAIGN instead. He could've won his own god damn home state and not have had a state ruled by the other candidate's brother and his own chief of staff [or whatever Katherine Harris' title was] as the head of the Board of Elections or whatever she was.

Don't blame people who have been pushed aside by their own party for wanting a candidate who at least vaguely resembles a Democrat. Pro-war, anti-choice, anti-embryonic stem cell, pro-Aito, pro-Patriot Act... all those combined do not make him a Dem. Yes, there are Dems out there who may take one or two of the above listed issues, but all of them? Find me another Dem who wants Roe v. Wade overturned as well as everything else.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:56:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

It all boils down to a choice, sorry to say. And as angry as you can be about not having the choice you want, it makes no sense to act in a way that will help Santorum get re-elected. So if you want to improve Santorum's chances, then don't vote for Casey in November.

As to voting for Nader, I do in fact hold those folks responsible. If Nader had withdrawn, instead of telling the lie that Gore and Bush were the same, most of his votes in Florida would have gone to Gore and we would be in a different world. Nader's ego trumped his good sense.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:08:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

If Casey continues to pander Right and take the moderate/liberals in PA for granted, they're going to turn their backs on him in return.

I'd say Nader's ego triumphed in 2004. In 2000 he gave people a real alternative choice. In 2004 he was taking Rep. PAC money.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:12:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

Casey - and the Dems - can afford the risk. Relatively few people will not vote when faced with the possibility that it will help Santorum. Most people backing Pennachio and Sandals will recognize that it's cutting off their nose to spite their face to not vote and will instead hold their nose and vote for Casey. It's the only sane thing to do unless you want Santorum for six more years. Every vote not cast for Casey that would have been cast for Pennachio and Sandals is a vote for Santorum.

Nader just showed his true colors in 2004.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:19:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

You fail to realize how repugnant Casey is to a lot of people who truly despise Santorum. Leave it to the Democratic leadership to come up with one of the few candidates I could not vote for, not even as an alternative to Santorum.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 02:56:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

Why do you blame a Santorum re-election on people who refuse to vote for a shit-head like Casey instead of blaming the out-of-state Democratic leadership for trying to ram him down our throats?

That is strange logic if you ask me. In fact, applying the very same logic, any one who votes for Casey in the primary is to blame if we get six more years of Santorum.

Give me a break.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:35:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 0)

Your logic escapes me. It's a choice regardless of how that choice came to be. You can be angry at how Casey was put forward to run, but so what? You still have two choices to make. One in May and one in November.

All I'm saying is that if Casey is the Dem candidate in November, and you choose not to vote for him, you are helping Santorum. Your reasons for not voting for Casey and anger about how he got the nomination don't change the fact that you are helping Santorum.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:47:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question (none / 1)

I don't give a rats ass if Santorum wins if the choice is between him and Casey. Perhaps you see a major difference, but I don't, and I will not vote for someone who offends me every time he opens his mouth. Perhaps Booman is right that I should not inject the November election into this until after the primary, but the anyone-but-Santorum crowd needs to realize before the primary that Casey can't win because there are lots of people like me and others posting on this thread who simply will not hold their noses and vote for him. Two polls have suggested that Casey loses more than 20% of his support after respondents learn where he stands on the issues. Despite his current lead in the polls he loses in November if 20+ % of his potential votes evaporate. Think about that.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:06:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 3)

This just in:

Philly venue not debatable

On Saturday, Pennsylvania's three Democratic Senate candidates will travel to Slippery Rock University, in a pint-size town near the Ohio border, for their first debate.

They meet again April 19 in Lancaster - in one of the state's most heavily Republican counties.

One stop missing from the debate tour is the Southeast, home to 40 percent of the state's registered voters and an increasing number of Democrats.

Democrat Alan Sandals, a Center City lawyer, wanted one here. So did Chuck Pennacchio, a Bucks County professor.

But not the front-runner, Bob Casey Jr.

The League of Women Voters says it offered to organize debates any place at any time. And local TV networks offered to broadcast them, but only if Casey showed up, said Jackie Sallade, the group's debate coordinator.

"It is almost like they chose to do it where there wouldn't be a lot of publicity, where they wouldn't get noticed," Sallade said of the Casey campaign.

Casey's rivals would likely highlight his opposition to abortion and expansion of embryonic stem cell research - issues that put him at odds with segments of the Philadelphia region's socially moderate voters.

"If they change their mind," Sallade said, somewhat wistfully, "all they need to do is call."

Don't wait by the phone.

- Carrie Budoff

You'd think Casey would jump at an opportunity for primetime exposure in bedrock Dem country. Obviously he does not believe doing this would be in his best interests. Clearly he knows that the more people that see him in action the lower his numbers will fall. Doesn't bode well for a race against Santorum in my humble opinion.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:37:04 AM EST

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You'd think Pennachio and Sandals would be delighted to showcase in the the conservative parts of the state. In any case, you're rooting against Casey. You're not voting for him in the primary or in the general. You're a Santorum person by default.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:53:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

They are delighted to showcase in the conservative parts of the state. Casey is frightened to shocase in the liberal part of the state. A part of the state with 40% of the state's registered voters.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:58:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

It's called "politics." Casey has nothing to gain by going to the liberal base of the party. They will vote for him regardless as they should except for a few that would rather have a tantrum. It's the conservative voters - those more likely to vote for Santorum - that need to be courted. That's where he needs to be to beat Santorum. Sorry to be so practical about all this, but as I said, "that's politics."

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:04:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

It's this whole "as they should" attitude that is turning people away from the Democratic party now. People staying home because they're so disgusted. Disgusted with how the Dems are playing to the "swing voters" who just never end up swinging their way no matter how much they pander to the Right.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:10:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

It's called "politics." It's called the "majority wins." It's a crummy game/process. Unless you want to argue that having Casey in the Senate and increasing the chances of getting a Dem majority is worse than having Santorum re-elected, then there is no choice but to vote for Casey in November. That's where "as they should" comes in.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:15:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

why the focus on November and not the focus on May. May is the primary. No one is talking about voting for Santorum in May. It's about whether or not we should support Casey in May.

Personally, I think jpol would make a more effective case if he didn't focus on his intention to abstain in November. Because that always allows the conversation to degenerate away from the point at hand. The point is twofold: first, why not vote for a progressive in the primary. And second, if you answer to one was an electability argument, jpol is warning you that Casey is a bum.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:19:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

First, jpol raised the issue. Second, because I think the focus is on November as the outcome of the primary is foretold.

Democrats have a long history of tearing themselves apart in primary elections and thereby giving fuel to the Republicans in the general. That is the bigger danger to Casey, not his positions on the issues.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:25:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (4.00 / 2)

Cut me a break. The first rule of dog training is "Don't reward behavior you don't want." I think it applies here too.

I don't want to see the Dems continue to clear the field for candidates that are virtually indistinguishable from Republicans on the issues! I'm not rewarding what Schumer and company did here by voting for Casey in the primary, or in November. They already decided that they didn't want or need my vote in November when they anointed Casey. I wish them luck, but I'm not supporting this BS.

If the Dem leadership wants progressive votes, they shouldn't ram conservative candidates down our throats. Blaming us for not supporting them wholeheartedly goes beyond the pale.

"Little people are very stuff-intensive."

by CabinGirl on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:37:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Unfortunately, you can't teach an old dog new tricks and as long as you want to work within the Dem party, then you are working with an old dog.

It all boils down to this: A vote for Casey in November helps the Dem party, whereas a failure to vote for Casey helps Santorum.

If Progressives want to see progress, they must be prepared to make progress incrementally. Casey is incremental improvement over Santorum if for no other reason than he's a Democrat.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:57:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

(now that my laughter at the limited logic of your arguments has subsided...)

What it really boils down to is that it's only April, and I'm looking forward to voting for my progressive choice in the primary. Save your "vote for Casey because at least he can't out-Santorum Santorum" advertisements until after May 16th.

"Little people are very stuff-intensive."

by CabinGirl on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:05:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You misrepresent my argument. (Maybe you are a closet Republican!!) I'm not saying to vote for Casey in Novemebr because "he can't out-Santorum Santorum." I'm saying to vote for him because he's a Democrat and we desperately need a Democratic majority in at least one house of Congress.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:37:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You suggest that anyone who doesn't support Casey in the primary is a de facto Santorum supporter, and accuse me of mis-representing? Too funny.

"Little people are very stuff-intensive."

by CabinGirl on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:49:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

I'm talking about November, not the primary.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:55:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

I'm saying to vote for him because he's a Democrat and we desperately need a Democratic majority in at least one house of Congress.

Not a good enough reason. Sorry. There are too many good reasons to flush your voter's registration card than to flush your integrity when it comes to candidates like casey or lieberman.

If that is your only reason to support him, you have lost already.

Support BooTrib

by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 02:03:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

whoa whoa WHOA.

HOLD UP!

No no no

You cannot blame progressive for tearing the party apart. Look at Casey's positions on the issues. It is Schumer that ignored Rendell's advice and recruited Casey. It is Rendell and Schumer that cleared the field for Casey as a condition of his entry. (Casey had just got pummelled by Rendell in a primary and knew he was not popular with the Dem base).

You piss us off, and shove a Sciavo-Republican down our throats, and then blame us?

No.

There is nothing I can do or say to convince jpol or dozens of other activist I know to vote for Casey, and they won't. I wish they would, if it comes to that. But don't blame them for being angry, or for refusing to endorse Casey.

It's the Dem leadership that caused this. They should have known better than to clear the field.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:30:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

I'm not blaming them for being angry or for not endorsing Casey for the primaries. I criticize them for not voting for Casey in November because it futhers Santorum's chances.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:35:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

I don't blame them for anything, but I do hope that the Democratic nominee wins in November, and I hope that progressives do not allow this travesty to prevent a vote for Reid coming out of Pennsylvania.

There is a primary first, though, and I don't agree that Casey is our strongest candidate.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:18:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

It's the Dem leadership that caused this. They should have known better than to clear the field.

Ditto!

Except for the "I wish they would" part... The more I see, the more I think that some Dems deserve to be really crushed before the Dem leadership will get the point. Casey is a prime example.

A "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation needs to be eliminated so progressives can finally move towards taking back control of anything.

Anyways... You know/understand where I am coming from, AND where I hope this all goes in the longrun! lol

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:45:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Boy, talk about politics as usual. In this case, let's lose an election and teach the party a lesson. If that's the goal, then the logical thing to do is to vote for Santorum (not just withold a vote for Casey). Assure that Casey loses. That'll show 'em.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:53:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Don't blame me, or any other progressive or liberal, simply for excercising a right to chose, and to chose according to OUR BELIEFS... Blame those that brought you this mess.

An endorsement for casey is an endorsement for santorum... They are the same animal and they both breed conservative policies. The only difference between the two?

No republican will not vote for casey, and many of the progressives will not vote for casey or santorum.

It is a hard reality to swallow... But get used to it. It is going to happen more often in the future.

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:08:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

What's with this blaming accusation? You feeling guilty?

You can believe what you want and do what you want. All I'm saying is that given a choice between two candidates, namely Casey and Santorum, that a failure to vote for Casey helps Santorum. That's a reality.

Your mistake is seeing Casey and Santorum as the same animal (like Gore and Bush were the same animal according to Nader). If they were, they'd be running against each other in the primary. In case you haven't noticed, Casey is running as a Democrat and Santorum as a Republican. If Casey wins, it helps thge Democrats. If Santorum wins, it helps the Republicans. That's a reality too.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:25:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You obviously have your mind set on blaming those that will no longer support conservatives in the Dem party. Is this a matter of staking out your "Nader of the future" to scapegoat future Dem losses? (Let's blame the people that will only vote for candidates they like... Don't blame the Dinos!) That sort of illogical thought process will no longer cut it in today's politics.

If santorum wins republicans win... If casey wins republican idealogy wins.

Neither of those outcomes serves any progressive or liberal's agenda in any way shape or form.

You disagree? Too bad. Get over it. I was over your illogical arguments after the first few things you wrote, and as you can see by the responses from most here, they are well over it too. Your logic may go over well with the "Win at all cost Dems!" That is the ideology that has the Dem party where it is today. (Sitting on the sidelines in all 3 branches...)

I'll stick to supporting what I believe in. Even if it means that a Dino Dem loses a seat. That is the reality. Deal with it. The "my way or the highway Dems" in the leadership are out of touch with reality. And that is a fact.

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 02:00:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

the funny thing is that he doesn't see the writing on the wall.

I'll vote for the Democratic nominee in November. But I am not blind enough to ignore that the biggest obstacle to beating Santorum is that so many of my brothers and sisters will not vote for the nominee if it is Casey.

Here's the reason: it is not that Casey is so conservative. It is that the Democratic activists did not get a choice of one of our own well credentialed and well-connected and well-financed progressive politicians to choose over Casey in the primary. If the Dems had a choice like that and the Dems chose Casey, most of my fellow activists would shrug and accept it. That is not what happened. Our primary became a farce. It became an annointment. And that is why Sandals and Pennacchio have a lot of support.

The blame for this comes from the decision to clear the field. Casey had an 18% lead over Rendell. But he lost, and lost badly to Rendell in the DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY. So, how could any political observer miss the likelihood that the Democratic Party's adherents would choke on being forced to vote for a candidate they just rejected adamently a few years before?

Do not blame the progressives. This was idiocy from Schumer and Rendell. They should have known that they would alienate the base and that the base would not turn out.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 02:10:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

"But I am not blind enough to ignore that the biggest obstacle to beating Santorum is that so many of my brothers and sisters will not vote for the nominee if it is Casey."

Why do you think I'm spending my time on here arguing that the reasonable, practical thing to do is to vote for Casey in November (assuming he's the Dem candidate, of course)?

Thanks for helping to make my case!

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:20:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

yeah, argue it all you want. I will argue it too after May. And I have argued it over drinks with albert, jpol, and CabinGirl. But they were not convinced by my arguments.

And that is what you are missing. They represent the heart and soul of the activist base.

It's painful. If you look at the Philly blogging scene you'll see that Atrios, Bowers, me, Susie Madrak, the folks at AllSpinZone, Young Philly Politics, etc, are all voting for Chuck and/or Sandals, but our readership is not inclined to vote for Casey in November. We are trying to warn you that hitching your horse to Casey is not a great idea, because we can't put the pieces of the party back together again.

At a certain point you have to stop and question whether Casey is the best candidate to beat Santorum. That is your assumption. I don't think it is a good assumption.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:34:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

OK, that's where we disagree. I think Casey is the best candidate to beat Santorum - name recognition, money, and stand on issues that appeal beyond Philly and Pittsburgh.

These are the same reasons he will beat Pennachio and Sandals.

As to whether albert, jpol and CabinGirl represent the heart and soul of the activist base is another matter. Whether they do or don't, inflexible positions to the point of political suicide helps no one - neither the Progressives or "main stream" Democrats.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 04:10:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

If Casey loses to Santorum, my conscious will be clear as I will have voted for him.

What you consider illogical is simply what doesn't fit your world view. An inflexible progressive - seems like a contradiction in terms.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:16:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

why the focus on November and not the focus on May.

And that is as important to consider as the diaries you see from some people that are already pimping their "Dem presidential ticket" choices when 2006 isn't even over with yet...

One hurdle at a time. Focus on the here and now.

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:54:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

They will vote for him regardless as they should except for a few that would rather have a tantrum.

In case you haven't noticed... There is a large movement going on, and it is a movement by Dems that will no longer hold their noses and vote against their interests anymore.

You can hold on to that Dino opinion and assume they will vote for Casey. But you will be wrong. He will never get the "hoped for" republican support and he will lose the support of much of the Dems that are fed up.

As much as santorum is a complete idiot, a Casey nomination will only hand the idiot the reigns again.

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:32:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

And if you think a Pennachio or Sandals nomination won't give Santorum the seat, you are dreaming. Casey is the only realistic choice to beat Santorum like it or not.

I've been an idealist - still am in many ways. Call me a sellout, but I'd rather the Dems have a shot at a majority and get the subpoena and investigative powers that go along with it for two years before the next presidential election. I'm looking to win this battle as we can't win the war without it.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:39:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

this is also wrong.

If you were to argue that Casey is going to win the primary so this is a waste of time, I might be inclined to grant your point (for the most part). But that is not what you are arguing.

You are arguing that Sandals and Pennacchio would not have a chance if they won the primary.

But that is flat-out wrong.

The Santorm race is the biggest race in the country this year and will get oodles of national press. Along with DeLay's race, this race will attract volunteers and money from all over the country. And there could be no bigger story than one in which the Dems of PA rose up and rejected an accomadationist like Casey and bucked the party and showed the power of the grassroots and the level of displeasure with Bush and the war that an upset would indicate.

If they won, they would have all the free publicity in the world, plus the mojo, plus the activists would be ecstatic and go out and work with Deaniac-like enthuisiam.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:49:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Yes, I am arguing that Pennachio and Sandals have no chance of winning the primary. They are unknown outside of the Philly area and their stands on the issues are largely unacceptable to the Alabama in between Philly and Pittsburgh. Casey has huge name recognition, appeals to many in Philly and Pittsburgh for no other reason than he's figured to be the best chance to beat Santorum and has credibility with the Alabamians of PA.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:33:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Look. You are rambling now.

Pennacchio's stands on the issues are no more unacceptable to the middle of the state than Casey's are to the city of Brotherly Love and its suburbs.

Casey has three advantages. Let's look at them.

he has super-duper name recognition, and his family is generally liked.
he has lots of cash.
he has the backing of the Party.

Now, in our dreamword where Casey loses the primary, the winner, let's say Chuck, would probably be on the cover of Time and Newsweek, profiled in every national paper, and invited on Oprah and every other television show.

The amount of energy to support his campaign, both within and without the state, would be much higher than it would for Casey.

Money would not be an issue for long. The party would forcefully back his campaign, and it is not unlikely that by November that Chuck would be more famous than Casey would be.

Your analysis is based on the fact that you think Casey will win, and you don't want him to do poorly in the primary, as that might hurt his chances in November. You can make a case for that, but you aren't. You are just flailing about with weak arguments.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:55:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Actually, since you restate my position so clearly, I don't see how you can say I'm flailing about.

You and the others here simply don't want to face the fact that not supporting Casey in November helps Santorum just like not supporting Pennachio if he were to win the primary would help Santorum. The problem is that Pennachio doesn't have a chance to win the primary. Yes, a nasty primary would hurt Casey (as it would the other candidates), although that bothers me less as I think Casey will sail through with little damage or distraction from Pennachio and Sandals. It's really that simple.

Regarding your dreamworld: It's fine to dream, but in politics, it's better to win than to dream. Of course, best of all is if your dreams win. Unfortunately, in November the choice will not include your dreams and you will have to choose between winning and a real nightmare of another six years of Santorum.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:07:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

you are flailing about because you just keep shifting the terms of the debate.

You keep assuming Casey will win the primary and ignoring that this diary is about why you should not vote for Casey in the primary.

I argue that Chuck could beat Rick, but you brush that aside.

Everytime the debate gets shifted from May to November, Casey's supporters can hijack the argument.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:23:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

I could say the same of you for supporting a candidate who is sure to go down in flames against Santorum.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:36:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Then let's talk probabilities. Of Pennachio, Sandals and Casey, which is the least likely to go down in flames against Santorum in November?

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:41:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Pennacchio because he can stake out the moral high ground (including refusing PAC money) and go after Santorum on the issues. Casey cannot do that.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:55:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You're a dreamer. I admire that.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:33:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

You're an admitted sellout and that's the only admirable thing I can see from you in this thread.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 02:37:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Being more of a realist does not make me a sellout. It makes me realistic.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:08:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Being uninformed and bull-headed and illogical may not make you a sellout, but it hardly makes you a realist.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:12:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Doesn't not make me a realist.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 06:14:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Hey, I'm only agreeing with you that you're a sellout. I didn't bring it up, you did.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 04:11:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

What are you Rove, Jr.? You used the word sellout, I didn't.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 06:09:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

No, you doofus, I'm only quoting you, you doofus.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 08:29:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

Nice name calling. How progressive of you. You must be Bill O'Reilly's replacement.

What an impressive heart and soul of the activist core of the democratic party.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:18:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You're calling yourself names, don't forget that. You're just trolling now.

--
Albert Yee
Philadelphia, PA
http://dragonballyee.com/blog

by albert (dragonballyeeATgmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:53:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

ctblogger did an interesting writeup on Doh Lieberman's latest appearance and it includes video where you can hear the boos amongst the applause everytime Doh's name is mentioned. (No mojo for Doh-Joe...)

It is likely that Casey wants to avoid the appearence of lack of support from the base that he deserves in the form of boos if he shows his face in front of too many progressives and voices his true opinions.

The funniest thing about the LIEberman appearence was giving out little pieces of a pine tree (or should I say pieces of a BUSH?) to his few supporters at the JJB event... Perhaps as a sign of Doh's true allegiance? Barrack Obama, in his keynote speech at this event, even made a comment about the "Elephant in the room" when discussing Lieberman. (I am not kidding about any of this!) Go check out the post and the video.

Sorry if this is off topic from the very real Casey/republican threat you are documenting here! :)

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:23:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

The problems in PA for Dems that CT doesn't have is that PA is pretty conservative and Santorum is a formidable contender and is also the incumbent. Doing damage to Joe L. will have little affect on his chances in November should he win the primary (btw, I would love to see Lamont beat him in the primary). In contrast, any damage the Dems do to Casey helps Santorum quite directly. Santorum will use whatever Pennachio and Sandals throw at Casey against him after the primaries. Count on it.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:32:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

See above comment...

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by Connecticut Man1 (connecticutman1 AT gmail DOT com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:34:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

your analysis is just plain wrong.

Let's just look at the biggest names in Pennsylvania politics:

Specter: pro-choice, endorsed by the teacher's unions
Rendell: pro-choice
Tom Ridge: pro-choice

How many states have had pro-choice Republican Governors and Senators in the last ten years?

Are any of those states red?

Pennsylvania hasn't voted for a Republican for President since 1988.

It has elected pro-life Democrats and pro-choice Republicans.

But, of course, this is not just about choice. This is about stem-cell research, it's about Terry Schiavo, it's about social issues generally.

Pennsylvania has only elected one culture warrior to statewide office, and that is Man on Dog, currently the second least popular Senator in his home state precisely because his culture warrior positions are so out of step with the state.

And Pennacchio and Sandals are not saying that Casey is a crook or a bad person. They are saying that he has similar positions to Santorum on the issues and on the war.

So, it is not clear to me how Rick can turn that to his advantage in November.

The only real damage we are doing to Casey is to educate the voters about his positions. And the Dems don't want to eat that porridge.

by BooMan on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:42:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

You're focusing on a single issue - abortion rights. I think you forgot that Specter is a Republican and that he's backed his president and party way more often than not. Pro-choice, but he pushed Alito, Thomas and Roberts, and is looking to help Bush out of the NSA scandal. Ridge was pro-choice (sorta), but also a Bush lackey.

Also, you forget that the state legislature is, and has been for years, Republican. And I don't know off hand the proportion, but there are loads of Republicans from PA in the House of Representatives in Washington.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 01:04:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Of course he will. He is doing it already. he has a letter posted on his site written by his campaign manager a week before Casey endorsed Samuel Alito. The letter thanks Casey in advance for his expected support of Alito, noting that Casey always waits for Santorum to research and stake out a position and then takes the same position. Santorum also has a new web site up that satirizes "Invisible" Bob.

Santorum can't wait to go after Casey. Casey is the one he wants to face because he knows he can beat him. It is the candidates trying to deprive Casey of a primary victory that you should be pulling for. They are the only ones who can beat Santorum. That is especially true of Chuck Pennacchio who is a charismatic campaigner who has built a formidable statewide grass roots organization.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 12:45:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 1)

The notion that Pennsylvania is conservative or that the center of the state is Alabama is a myth. A recent Quinnipiac poll that broke the state down into 7 regions did show that some areas lean conservative while Philadelphia and to a lesser extent Pittsburgh lean liberal. But even in the areas that leaned right, over 40% of the respondents were pro-choice. Bush had negative approval ratings throughout the state. The war was unpopular throughout the state.

People often used tired chiches that are unsupported by the facts, and the Pennsylvania/Alabama analogy is one of them.

jpol

by jpol on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 03:10:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Do the math. If 40% leaned pro-choice as many as 60% leaned pro-life, although I expect some were undecided.

If PA is not as conservative as I say, please explain to me why Santorum was elected twice, why the state legislature is majority Republican and why so many Congressmen are Republican.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 06:08:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

Here's some data to confuse your hypothesis:

12 out of 19 US Congressional seats in PA are held by Republicans. At the state level 29 out of 50 Senators are Republican (1 seat is vacant) and 109 out of 203 State reps are Republican (2 seats are vacant). So we got a state where

100% of US Senators
63% of US Congressmen
59% of State Senators (sitting)
54% of State Representatives (sitting)

are Republican. Rendell is the exception.

And you're telling me this is a liberal leaning state? No, it's still Philly and Pittsburgh with Alabama in between.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 06:44:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

The fact that PA has a significant conservative pool of voters is exactly why we shouldn't be running a phoney like Casey against Santorum, who is the real deal. I get the idea that Casey supporters think that PA voters are stupid. They think the base will vote against their interests by voting for Casey and - and this is the real stumper - they think that conservatives will be fooled by Casey's I'm-a-Democrat-no-I'm-not positions on every issue that matters.

But guess what - PA voters aren't stupid. The Dem leadership is. I really hope that when Casey loses - hopefully in May but if not, then definitely in November - everyone remembers to put the blame where it belongs.

No more Me-Too Dems!

by eRobin (eRobin@gmail.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 10:01:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

So Casey isn't really conservative. You folks need to make up your minds.

Interesting strategy though. Faced with a large contingent of conservative leaning voters, you want to run a liberal candidate because you can't win the conservative leaning voters if you run a conservative leaning candidate. Is because people tend to vote or not vote for those who match their own beliefs and attitudes? I must be missing something here.

by accumbens on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 11:22:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

This is Chuck's plan to win:

Forget the conservative Republican PA voters. They will vote for Santorum.
Forget the people who self-identify as swing voters but who are really Republican super voters, they will vote for Santorum. (These are the people upon whom Casey is counting. This is one of the big reasons he will lose.)
Count on the progressives and moderate progressives to vote for Chuck.
Cultivate and count on the moderate Dems in the famous T, who are currently cowed into submission by the GOP in the area. They are desperate for someone with vision to lead them to the promised land.
Count on the true swing voters, who, at the end of the day, vote "character" above all else. They will be won over by Chuck's conviction and his willingness to fight not only the GOP but also the venal corporate interests and Me-Too Dems in his own party.
Pennacchio is a true maverick. These voters love mavericks. Casey is a Kerry without the charm. Voters see through that in no time.

It's really that simple.

No more Me-Too Dems!

by eRobin (eRobin@gmail.com) on Tue Apr 4th, 2006 at 10:32:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. (none / 0)

How is it possible, after reading this summary, for anyone with a functioning brain to find it possible to support the PA. dem party and the national dem party. If this is what I am supposed to accept as a party that is speaking for me-- No way Jose! Not A Chance! Are you out of your effing mind!
COUNT ME OUT!
billjpa@aol.com

by billjpa (billjpa@aol.com) on Mon Apr 3rd, 2006 at 08:28:47 PM EST

The Quotable Bob Casey Jr. | 89 comments (89 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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Unequal Sisters: A Multicultural Reader in U.S. Women's History (Third Edition)

The Undercover Economist: Exposing Why the Rich Are Rich, the Poor Are Poor And Why You Can Never Buy a Decent Used Car!

The Worst Hard Time: The Untold Story of Those Who Survived the Great American Dust Bowl
by Timothy Egan

Green Press Initiative
----- * ^ * -----

Journalistas: 100 Years of the Best Writing and Reporting by Women Journalists by Eleanor Mills * NYT review

Bury Me Standing: the Gypsies & Their Journey

1491: New Revelations of the Americas before Columbus

Brokeback Mountain
by Annie Proulx
----- * ^ * -----
Check out Powell's
"At The Movies"

Imperial Ambitions: Conversations on the Post-9/11 World by Noam Chomsky (Power & Terror: Post 9-11 Talks)

The Price of Privilege:

How Parental Pressure and
Material Advantage Are Creating a Generation of
Disconnected and Unhappy Kids
by Madeline Levine

Save 35-70% on
name brand clothing,
footwear, and outdoor gear
at SierraTradingPost.com
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We listened to PEN American Center's "State of Emergency" and found 1940s books by Curzio Malaparte only at Alibris. (Selection (MP3) excerpted from "The Skin.")

Banned Books * Are you a fan of Film Noir, Art House, Documentaries or Hong Kong Action? * Searching for a long-lost children's book or a first printing of Miles Davis' Kind of Blue on vinyl? Find it at Alibris!

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