Booman Tribune ~ DC: Making the People Angry

DC: Making the People Angry

by BooMan
Thu May 24th, 2007 at 11:49:34 AM EST

The Dems decided to punt. They couldn't split off any noticeable number of Republicans and too many of them didn't want to spend Memorial Day recess hearing that they were stranding the troops in Iraq.

The number of Democrats likely to vote for the Iraq measure ranges from about 60 to a slight minority of the caucus, around 110.
Even House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) is expected to vote against it. But House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.) will probably vote yes.
“With a stubborn, delusional president, we’re never going to win,” said Rep. Jim McDermott (D-Wash.). “We’re dealing with an administration that refuses to deal with reality. We have no way to evict him from office.”

Actually, there is a way, but it requires splitting off Republicans. We failed this time. But, this newest half Friedman Unit will be the last with Republican unity.

The Republicans are pissing off their base with immigration legislation, the Democrats are pissing off their base by caving on war funding, and the President is pissing everyone off. It's as if Washington actually wants the country to rise up and invade their little municipality and put all their heads on spikes.

I hope they enjoy talking to their constituents over the holiday.

DC: Making the People Angry | 31 comments (31 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (4.00 / 3)

The Dems decided to punt. They couldn't split off any noticeable number of Republicans and too many of them didn't want to spend Memorial Day recess hearing that they were stranding the troops in Iraq.

Do the Democrats think there will ever be a day when they can vote to end the war and not be accused of stranding the troops? Doing what is right in this situation is called courage.

I really wish I could believe that in the next four months there will be a seismic shift in the viewpoint of this Congress, but I have some serious doubts. With comments like McDermott's is it any wonder the Dems are storing their cajones in a shoebox and handing the box to Bush for safekeeping?

When will we get someone with courage to stand up and say "STOP !!!". There will come a point when someone, somewhere is going to have to stare this President in the eye, point a finger and put it on the tip of his nose and say "No more, Mr. President. We and the American people are done".

Where is that person right now? We need them to step up and lead. That is their raison d'etre. Someone has to muster the courage to stand up to this obstinate administration.

"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity"

by MikeInOhio (miken45054@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:37:01 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (4.00 / 3)

Why should anyone expect Republicans to peel off and side with Dems when a large number of Dems don't have the intergrity/courage to take on the President. I just can't see the logic of that expectation at all.

If you want things to get better, be prepared to deal with change.

by Kahli on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:40:35 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (4.00 / 3)

Amen, Kahli. What motivation is there for Republicans to hook their wagon to the Dem's train when the Dem's are too afraid to even leave the station?

Life in the DC bubble must drain human beings of all capability for rational thought. What other explanation can there be?

"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity"

by MikeInOhio (miken45054@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:47:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 1)

No kidding....as it is we have to peel off Dems. to get them to vote with the people. Two big steps back, I'm afraid.

by Birdie on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 07:44:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (4.00 / 3)

Coming close to making the 2 party system irrelevant. Isn't there anyone on the left capable of making obvious to the public that soldiers will not be left stranded without bullets/weaponry?

Oh, there you are, Perry. -Phineas -SLB-

by boran2 (blogistan@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 02:35:10 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (4.00 / 2)

Puzzles me too, Boran. The mainstream media does nothing but repeat the talking points of the White House with regard to the funding issue. Like Olbermann pointed out, people are left with the impression that if Congress doesn't give Bush everything he wants then the troops will be left with only handfuls of bullets to throw at the enemy. This is just a patently false statement. But that narrative is all you hear, day after day, on all levels. No one in the media appears to even give a minutes thought to evaluating that statement. They are zombies for the cheerleaders of the war.

"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity"

by MikeInOhio (miken45054@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 02:51:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This is what I don't get. (none / 0)

Maybe I am missing something.

The Democrats are going to give the President money to fund the war through September now, right?

But they've already passed the FY 2008 budget, which begins...you guessed it, Oct. 1 2007. And included in the Department of Defense portion of the budget is 235.1 billion dollars for the operations in Iraq and Afghanistan.

So, if they aren't going to use the power of the purse now, don't they essentially lose that power for the foreseeable future?

Please tell me I am wrong.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:20:50 PM EST

It's all off budget. (none / 1)

That's what you missed. None of the budget deadlines mean jack-shit, since it's all done as a special supplement. And it will continue to be.

Of course, it is disgusting and a HUGE lie that Bush, that total asshole, continues to pretend that he is reducing the deficit.

The Democrats should include an amendment saying that this supplemental will count against the budget deficit.

by dataguy on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:38:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's all off budget. (none / 1)

I know that most of the funding for the war has gone through the emergency appropriations / supplemental route, which don't count towards the budget. The current bill is no different from that.

But what I'm saying is that after this current crop of funding is used up, Bush won't have to go back to Congress for more (at least for a while) because there is money available that has already been appropriated.

And yes, I agree on the budget deficit. If a corporation were doing that, it'd be called "cooking the books". When the government does it, it's just standard practice. Sick.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:43:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Nah, you're wrong - sorry (none / 0)

He has never played by the budget rules. He knows good and well exactly what the war will cost. That's what statistics is for. We can predict pretty accurately.

But he knows that a true accounting of costs would be a huge problem.

If he needs money, he will just go back for another supplemental. What's to stop him?

by dataguy on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:19:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Nah, you're wrong - sorry (none / 0)

I'm fine with being wrong, but so far I fail to see where you've said anything about the substance of my argument. You're looking it as purely accounting shenanigans, and I haven't disagreed with any of that.

But my point is this: The President has, ostensibly, a pool of funds with which to prosecute this war. That pool is being refreshed from time to time with monies appropriated through supplementals passed by the Congress. This is why he has to keep going back for more. Correct?

The FY 2008 budget that has already been passed includes another $235 billion that has been allocated for prosecuting this war thereby re-filling that pool of funds. So when the current supplemental's funds run out in September, he won't have to go back to Congress for more funds just then. I'm not claiming that the budgeted amount will cover all the costs of the war through the entire year (because yes, that's ludicrous). And I'm not saying he won't ask for more funds. I'm saying he won't have to. Is that correct? And if not, please tell me why not, I'm obviously not a governmental budgeting expert.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:44:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

OK, we agree (none / 1)

I guess I was not reading carefully enough. I think that we agree

by dataguy on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:47:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'd like y'all to picture something (none / 0)

Colorado 2008
Democratic National Convention

Vichy dem Ken Salazar everywhere in the media, presenting Joe Liebermanlike views and highlighting the cringing, doglike subservience of his type of dem.

Looks like we get to have this cozy capitulating feeling for quite a while.

by Tehanu on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:26:32 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 0)

I'm sure part of the Dem's calculation is precisely that the War Funding debate empowers Repugs even in the minority. I'm sure they'd like to continue their partywide smackdown than have to sit down with them and have everything on the table while also assuming responsibility for the War that they claim to want, but obviously don't .

Declaring the bottom is the only way back up..

by anarchronarchist (mincers (-at-) hotmail (-dot-) com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:29:47 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 1)

Go ahead and hammer the Dems over the recess. They earned it. But you know what? You'll be posting the exact same article 4 months from now. "Dems Punt on Iraq AGAIN."

Why? The Dems don't want to leave Iraq. Hillary especially. Why? They see how Karl Rove is running things. They think they can do a better job in '08 and not get caught using Rove's dirty tricks.

More at Zandar vs. The Stupid.

by Zandar1 on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 12:49:44 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 0)

Zandar, I wish I could say "You're crazy" but at this point, given where we are, I just can't do it.

"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity"

by MikeInOhio (miken45054@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:04:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The American people aren't ready (none / 0)

The article Booman wrote about the foreign policy establishment could have easily been written about the whole country.

by AliceDem on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:31:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 0)

They didn't punt, they negotiated. There's a big difference. They bargained things that they wanted (minimum wage) for things that they should have needed for moral purposes (deadlines.) That's a political position that's unethical in my view.

I could actually have accepted a two month, clean, continuing resolution for funding with no other addenda. It was a matter of votes.

But let Bush accept the responsibility for vetoing Katrina aid, farm aid, etc. Now he approves it, and makes the "spin" so complex that the guy at the 7/11 can't understand it. They acted like politicos and it's shameful.

Most important now: The sense of Congress must be that the August reporting CANNOT come only from Petraeus but from an independent commission.

Michaela

by michaelmt (MrMichael_t@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:20:17 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 1)

I'm not much of a wheeler dealer, but I kind of thought that when one starts negotiations, one goes in with some things you know will have to be given up, so you kind of exagerate your demands up front. The bill that was vetoed was so weak to begin with that the Dems really left themselves no negotiating room. At least that's what it seems like to me.

If you want things to get better, be prepared to deal with change.

by Kahli on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:55:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

We have one option (none / 1)

Pin the War on George.

Every single Dem should say the following all weekend:

This is the war that Bush and the Republicans want. This is their war.
We support the troops.
Bush wants permanent war, and he won't accept anything less.
We must elect a Dem president to end this war.

Pin the War on George

by dataguy on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:20:47 PM EST

Re: We have one option (none / 1)

The way I feel, the Dems can do their own damn PR.

by Tehanu on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:24:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Although my post was confusing, (4.00 / 3)

that really is what I meant.

I meant to say "Dem politician"

by dataguy on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:31:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We have one option (none / 1)

How do you pin the war on George when you're down there talking big and then kissing his ass when the time comes? How do you day this is the war the GOP wants when you voted to keep it going. I don't see the traction there.

FDR's response to progressive demands: "I agree. Now go out and make me do it."

by DaveW on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 01:54:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Olbermann special comment (none / 1)

A comment about... betrayal

The Democratic leadership has surrendered to a president-if not the worst president, then easily the most selfish, in our history-who happily blackmails his own people, and uses his own military personnel as hostages to his asinine demand, that the Democrats "give the troops their money";
The Democratic leadership has agreed to finance the deaths of Americans in a war that has only reduced the security of Americans;
The Democratic leadership has given Mr. Bush all that he wanted, with the only caveat being, not merely meaningless symbolism about benchmarks for the Iraqi government, but optional meaningless symbolism about benchmarks for the Iraqi government.
The Democratic leadership has, in sum, claimed a compromise with the Administration, in which the only things truly compromised, are the trust of the voters, the ethics of the Democrats, and the lives of our brave, and doomed, friends, and family, in Iraq.

The video is a must-watch. You can see it at the link.

by Alexander on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 02:04:38 PM EST

Re: Olbermann special comment (none / 0)

I really really love KO. He can be just spitting mad, but his diction and his verbal clarity just gets better! (unlike me who just sputters and gasps!)

I did write my dems today:
We've tried voting and even with the Rove
calculus using felon lists, phony mailings, last minute smears, giving dem wards fewer machines and making dems wait in line long times and losses of votes for the dems on machines (remember fl with at least 18,000 votes missing?) and now the dems supposedly lead both chambers. But dems tell us we still don't have the numbers, still don't have the clout to slow or stop this war. We watch dems kowtow to 28% Bush approval ratings. We watch Bushco sneer at subpoenas. We watch the repubs repeat Bushco talking points ad nauseum. We watch our civilization draining down the tube. We see the lead up to a war with Iran and the can't think straight gang haven't truly been successful with any of its wars yet - Afghanistan included.

And all through that we sit and type and watch and type. We write congress and senate. However, I don't think it is working. In fact I haven't seen a victory on the hill yet. We can't even get good armor for the troops. (So much for the"I support the Troop group!) We have no reforms yet concerning the lobbying corruption, or no ethics committee that would stop a Duke Cunningham. I know the dems have their own talking points, but they don't doing anything more for me than the repub talking points.

And the stench of corruption just grows and grows like the pollution in the Potomac that Randy Duke Cunningham would fill his hot tub with.

I am so disappointed by the capitulation by the dems in the Iraq spending bill. I am disappointed about the lack of progress in ethics reform. NOTHING seems to matter except the appearance of the thing, not the reality of the war itself.

Grandma Jo

by glitterscale (glitteryscale@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 03:30:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Olbermann special comment (none / 0)

We were hoping that the Dems would save us from Bush. But they look just as much as if they are a subsidiary of the same conglomerate the Republicans are a subsidiary of—the War Party—as they were in the months following 9/11. The two parties are nothing more than brands the purpose of which is to create the illusion that we as citizens have a ability to choose between different policies, that we live in a democracy.

by Alexander on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 04:57:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The political party of most (none / 0)

repugs and dems should be concorporaterats - the con in honor of the repugs who spend all their waking life figuring cons and the rats honoring dems who betray us. And, of course, corporate be cause that is where they get their money and bribes and honoraria and jobs for family members.

Grandma Jo

by glitterscale (glitteryscale@yahoo.com) on Sun May 27th, 2007 at 09:25:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 0)

"put all their heads on spikes."

Viva La Resistance!
Viva the strong, viva the proud, viva the fight!

John Mccain Called his wife WHAT??

by brendan on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 02:07:56 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 0)

Everyone should print out Glenn Greenwald's column from earlier today, Improvement in Iraq and stick it to their wall. Print out copies and give it to all your Republican friends and those you know who think this war is worth continuing ad infinitum. In September, after General Petraeus gives his September assessment, sit down with them, go over his column, and show them how silly and out of touch we are over here on the left. I guarantee you Greenwald's analysis will be a much truer reflection of reality than all the Malkins, Kristols and Krauthammers conjured realities combined.

"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity"

by MikeInOhio (miken45054@yahoo.com) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 02:36:35 PM EST

Now just where did I put my pitchfork? (none / 1)

and my torch?

by northcountry on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 03:50:40 PM EST

Re: DC: Making the People Angry (none / 1)

Punting at this point simply delays the time our troops can leave the place. In the process, people will die. In the process, our economy becomes more fragile. In the process we will have hopelessly lost our way, I'm afraid.

We need to push for Progressive change, now more than ever.

by keepinon (jaukkuri@sbcglobal.net) on Thu May 24th, 2007 at 04:49:03 PM EST

DC: Making the People Angry | 31 comments (31 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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