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Democratic Debate Thread

by BooMan
Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:42:08 PM EST

At 8pm CNN will air the first one-on-one debate between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. Clinton will probably have to answer questions about the Kennedy endorsements, her time on the board of Wal*Mart, and her husbands involvement in a uranium mining deal in Kazakhstan. I wonder what the Big Dog thought of Borat: Cultural Learnings of America for Make Benefit Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan?

I'm not sure what they'll hit Obama with. The Rezko thing is pretty dead now that the Chicago Tribune, which has led the way on that investigation, said the following while endorsing Barack:

Last week, Hillary Clinton attacked Obama for his association with alleged influence-peddler Tony Rezko. If Obama had dealt with the Rezko issue forthrightly long ago, it might rank in public memory with Clinton's remarkable success in cattle futures.
Instead, as we've said, Obama has been too self-exculpatory. His assertion in network TV interviews last week that nobody had indications Rezko was engaging in wrongdoing strains credulity: Tribune stories linked Rezko to questionable fundraising for Gov. Rod Blagojevich in 2004 -- more than a year before the adjacent home and property purchases by the Obamas and the Rezkos.
One more time, Senator:
You need to divulge all there is to know about that relationship. Until you do, the journalistic scrubbing and opposition research will intensify. You should have recognized Rezko as a political seducer of young talent. But given that you've not been accused of any crime or ethical breach, your Rezko history is not a deal-breaker.
Nor do we know of similar lapses during the 12 years we've been watching Obama.
To the contrary, the professional judgment and personal decency with which he has managed himself and his ambition distinguish Barack Obama. We endorse him convinced that he could lead America in directions that the other Democrats could not.

What do you expect to see?

Democratic Debate Thread | 112 comments (112 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

My mind is open (none / 0)

But here's something to smile about.

I'm thinking that there will a few questions about Edwards. I would not be surprised if Wolf Blather asked, "Do you think John Edwards should endorse you and why?"

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:46:12 PM EST

Re: My mind is open (none / 0)

omg - the perfect dumb question of the night.

So ... I tuned in and ... no red carpet?

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:49:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: My mind is open (none / 1)

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:59:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: My mind is open (none / 0)

Hillary should have worn something brighter. This called for it. Obama didn't have much choice but she did.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:05:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: My mind is open (none / 0)

read at TPM - Sen. Durbin, co-chair of Obama's bid being quoted this Democratic Convention could be the first brokered convention since 1956.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:05:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary will come out swinging. Her national numbers are dipping and the narrative the past few days with the endorsements don't help. She will go on the attack, and try to put Obama on the defensive. This is actually a low risk, high reward strategy for her.

If I were Obama, in response, I would talk about the importance of ideas over old political tricks, and call her desperate.

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:53:15 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

and i think Edwards absence also facilitates her strategy

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:56:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

debate format leaves Obama flat.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:07:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I'm gonna have to watch the re-run of Olberman at 12E/9P because he's doing a Special Comment on FISA - at the same time as the debate! But right after the debate (10E/7P,) he's doing a 1-hour special about the debate, even though it was on another network. I'll have to remember to switch channels.

Anyway, I expect Obama to pick on Bill's involvement in the Billary campaign somehow and Hillary will have to prove she's relevant in her own campaign. That should be entertaining.

I think Hillary will try to hit back for Obama's accusation in a mailer that she strongly supported NAFTA as part of the administration that enacted it. (She didn't love it at the time, but it's part of what she counts as "experience" so it's "fair game" by her own standards.)

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:55:39 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I expect to see much more intelligent discourse than what we witnessed at last night's Republican debate.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:57:41 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

You always go for the risky bet, don't you? ;)

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:58:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I was really hoping someone would respond with 'Duh!'.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:59:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

That was too predictable. duh

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:01:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

Because it's a one-on-one debate, I hope Wolfie gives them some time to themselves to question each other and just keeps out of it. But he just loves to hear himself speak, so maybe not.

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:00:13 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

i think wolf will, actually

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:03:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Rezko did manage to spred his tips. RAWSTORY has an AP item that Hillary's co-chair got a small tip

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:00:29 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

California crowd is who I'm betting on. Their energy is right at the top and now that it's down to just the 2, there's gonna be some tilting of swords.

by mainsailset on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:00:50 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Oh good -- the camera swept down from above just like the Oscars. :)

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:02:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

It's been a good day for Obama.

Obama was endorsed by Paul VOlcker, former chairman of Federal Reserve that served under 5 presidents since Carter.
He reported raising $32 million in January, an astonishing amount with 170,000 added new donors.

Now, I betcha if Hillary's fund-raising numbers in January were anywhere close to Obama, she'd have been doing "a me too, looky here"
imho, she's low on funds and is being selective on where they deploy. That $32 million will keep Obama going beyond Feb. 5.

As I mentioned upthread, Sen Durbin said it could end up being a brokered convention

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:17:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I am waiting with bated breath for BooMan's in depth analysis of Hillary's pantsuit.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:03:34 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I love it. But the necklace and earrings are goddamn hideous.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:09:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I think the turquoise/brown accents are great - very southwest of her. Trust me on that one.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:10:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

she looks great in the jacket, but the accessories make her look like she is in an aquarium.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:11:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

over at the orange palace

a Latino coup: Obama's Piolín boost

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:20:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

The jewelry "dressy" level doesn't seem to match the "dressy" level of the suit.

They don't seem to go together.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:11:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

She looks like my blog.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:19:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Mine too ;)

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:22:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

LOL (none / 0)

We're like blog cousins. I see Tio Tony's background in your blog.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:24:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Which one will say "I want to thank the Acadamy" first?
"These are the photographers. They will take pictures. "

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:03:54 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

Tonight on Presidential Jeopardy!

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:04:32 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

heh

Hillary: I'll take political contributions for $100.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:06:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

more like $131.5 million

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:21:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Oh my! They have to sit in chairs right next to each other... not even across a table from each other.

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:04:52 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

they are awfully close...

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:05:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The audience (none / 0)

Just looking at the photos, I see a lot of well known Clinton supporters, but the Obama rally outside the theater today was supposedly awesome.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:05:45 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

She's feisty.

Wolf: There are no rules.

Hillary: (wicked laugh.)

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:05:53 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Barack opens with a pitch to the Edwards supporters.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:06:21 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I was friends with Hillary before this race. I'll be friends with Hillary after this race.

No promises for the between time.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:08:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I caught that too. Funny.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:09:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

Obana stakes out the high ground immediately.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:07:24 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Building the bridge back to the 20th century...

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:08:11 PM EST

Obama's opening statement (none / 1)

This is a very diplomatic opening:
Kudos to Edwards
Kudos to the other candidates
Kudos to Clinton
And a laundry list of issues.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:08:17 PM EST

Re: Obama's opening statement (none / 1)

Very good opening for Obama

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:09:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

She's glaring at him, this is gonna interesting to see how they react to one another sitting so close. Last night there were sparks flying between Willard and St. McCain

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:09:00 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

All the Republicans hate Mittens. It's palpable.

It may be the only thing I have in common with them.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:10:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Different Clinton (none / 0)

She actually admitted that Obama could win. She's never done that before.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:09:22 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Ready on day 1. She's gonna run the whole government all by herself because she's a "hands-on manager!"

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:10:16 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary has her "soft, confidential" voice going. Leaning forward. Not inclusive like he was.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:10:20 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Wow, does she look smug. What's up with that?

"Nobody can give you freedom. Nobody can give you equality or justice or anything. If you're a man, you take it." - Malcolm X

by Woodpecker on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:10:34 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

1. Hillary beliefs passionately that every last American should give their last dollar to the HMO's.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:12:20 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Appeals to Edwards voters by saying her plan is like his.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:12:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

2. I won't talk to dictators.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:13:30 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Most important policy difference

Hillary: healthcare - we must have universal healthcare; mortgage crisis - wants a moratorium of 90 days, freeze interest rates for 5 years. foreign affairs - be realistic (but then puts in shades of the fear stuff there). then goes after GOP saying they are more of the same

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:13:41 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Probably because I've heard that list so often I found it hard to not phase out on her.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:14:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

whenever Barack speaks, it looks like Hillary is gripping her hands so hard that the fingers are losing circulation.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:16:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Please, o please, let this be substantive.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:13:42 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Watching it on TV with a windoe on my PC open to the live dial group feed online. Like 30 seconds or so delay between them. Hard to follow, but I'm watching for peaks.

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:15:34 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

Barack wants to make sure we can all afford to put health care on our families.

Tengo un sueño.

by ejmw (ewitham (at) umich (dot) edu) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:15:35 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

It's good that Obama went second on this because Hillary only talked about herself - he gets to talk about policy differences. He gets to say (or imply) that his policy is better.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:15:40 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Gotta give Hillary props on the "we're not more of the same."

"Nobody can give you freedom. Nobody can give you equality or justice or anything. If you're a man, you take it." - Malcolm X

by Woodpecker on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:15:40 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

did Hillary just eat a pickle?

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:16:02 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 1)

It's hard when your lips are supposed to smile but your eyes won't cooperate.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:17:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Looks to me like she wants one. She's looking at Obama like a cheerleader looking at the hot QB she just bagged for prom.

"Nobody can give you freedom. Nobody can give you equality or justice or anything. If you're a man, you take it." - Malcolm X

by Woodpecker on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:18:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

heh, they are both talking alot about their similarities with Edwards - it's clear that they are both after those voters.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:17:31 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

really excellent answer from Obama...it all resonated with me, and I hate the health care plans anyway.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:18:46 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

These plans are so bad that they are almost not worth trying. If they succeed, we'll never ever get single payer.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:22:07 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

single payer just got applause from the crowd. Clinton: "very difficult to achieve for many reasons"

which reasons? that's a good followup

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:23:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

which reasons?

Mainly the existence of Republicans. Secondly, the fear of Republicans. Thirdly, actual dependence on PAC money from HMO's and big pharma.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:28:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

The way to get single-payer is to allow anyone to buy into Medicare and force private to compete w/ Medicare. They can't compete with the most efficient healthcare system in the world - Medicare. Private insurance will gradually go a way.

by RandyH on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:25:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Truthfully I think that nobody tunes in too much on the details. They just want to know that each has a plan.

How come the Republicans don't get grilled on the details of their plans? Because they don't have any.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:25:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

The Republican's plan is less jobs, more wars.

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:27:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

You have to give Hillary credit for learning from her 90's health care debacle. Make sure everyone knows that if you like your plan you can stay with it.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:23:11 PM EST

OMG (none / 0)

I hate hearing people talking about healthcare. That may make me a bad Democrat, but it's such a bulky subject, that we get these dumb explanations that are so stilted.

Send me an email!

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:23:21 PM EST

Re: OMG (none / 0)

hammered her on negotiating behind closed doors.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:26:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I might have been wrong. It has been surprisingly civil so far.

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:25:27 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

it's early.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:29:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I'm glad this is a sitting debate. For some reason Obama always does better sitting than standing. He's better than normal tonight.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:27:34 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Wolf perceives a 'swipe' at Hillary on Obama's part re health care plan differentiations & jumps to highlight it; easy to see what Wolf believes he's doing here.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:28:38 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

yep

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:29:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

how are doctors going to stop working for insurance companies and get back to working for patients?

That's insulting.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:31:40 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Do you think anybody except political junkies is really listening to all this substance?

Yet another health care related question .. tax and spend.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:32:06 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I don't know, but I like Barack's attack on Republicans and McCain

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:33:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

soon they'll tune out too.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:33:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oops (none / 0)

The Straight Talk Express lost a wheel...Nice Obama

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:33:03 PM EST

Re: Oops (none / 0)

That even got a "real" laugh from Hillary.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:33:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Costanza!

by liberaljournal on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:34:30 PM EST

It seems they both agreed (none / 0)

To attack Republicans tonight. I like that strategy. Going hard negative will be harmful for both of them I think.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:35:09 PM EST

Yeah (none / 0)

Neither can afford to stumble so it's safer to attack Republicans.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:36:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary is stumbling on this answer on how she'll pay for her healthcare plan. It seems too rehearsed. If I was interviewing her (which I do regularly at my job), my b.s. meter would be peaking.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:36:06 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

She was very measured & deliberate as she started her response -- it seemed uncharacteristic.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:41:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I like that they're both re-framing the whole tax and spend meme that Leslie is hammering on. Moral obligations of the rich and all that jazz.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:38:26 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I like that.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:38:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I hope to god they get off of Healthcare soon.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:38:30 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

I wonder how often Hillary will harken back to the Clinton administration tonight.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:39:08 PM EST

FWIW (none / 0)

The CA state legislature just failed to pass a state mandated health ins. plan (thank goodness), so that's why there's such a focus on healthcare. Unfortunately, it didn't seem like too many Californians were aware of the possible legislation.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:39:13 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Score for Hillary in reminding people that they were better off in the Clinton 90's when they paid higher rates.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:39:26 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Going forward, though, I wonder how she'll straddle the line between the past & future 'change'.

I suppose we're only talking about very incremental change -- from the past 7 years only. In that case, all the candidates represent similar change & she gives me no compelling reason to choose her particularly.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:46:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Wait a minute -- hasn't she just described herself as complicit with scapegoating?

(Paraphrase): 'People want answers as to why they're doing badly economically -- so I ask them, what would you do with all those illegal immigrants?'

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:52:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

immigration time - framing it as a negative to the african american population.

obama - all are feeling economically insecure, even before the recent wave of immigrants. calls it scapegoating - huge applause from crowd

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:40:19 PM EST

My goodness Obama nailed that immigration ? (none / 1)

That was awesomely brilliant. I hear neighbors cheering!

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:41:10 PM EST

Re: My goodness Obama nailed that immigration ? (none / 0)

Really? You can hear your neighbors cheering?

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:41:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I thought it was a game at first (none / 0)

But the "O-bama" chanting tipped me off that it wasn't. I went out for a smoke and I can hear someone on the next street over has their TV out and their watching. They usually do that for games and boxing matches. They certainly have never done it for a primary. Must be proximity.

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by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:47:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary is taking the immigration question to the right of Obama.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:43:14 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Yes. Do you think this is a GE strategy or is it a California strategy that I just don't understand?

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:44:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

even though I am interested in the subject, she bored me to distraction. Guess that was the point since the question was on driver's licenses.

by BooMan on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:45:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

It sounded completely political - as though there were poll tested.

by maryb2004 on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:47:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'm sorry (none / 0)

But Clinton's talking points sound like she stole Giuliani's immigration talking points.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:46:10 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary is lying, she's been using a line lately that includes the abhorrent line: "with no legal process"

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:46:17 PM EST

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Preview is my friend...

this is in regards to deportation of migrants with criminal records. she is pandering to a hardliner crowd with that

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:47:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democratic Debate Thread (none / 0)

Damn straight.

by wilderness wench on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:55:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

[NEW THREAD ALERT] (none / 0)

Linkage to new thread

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 08:50:01 PM EST

Gag me (none / 0)

Did she balance the budget? No 3rd term!

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 09:12:41 PM EST

Democratic Debate Thread | 112 comments (112 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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