Booman Tribune ~ A Progressive Community

Wisconsin Returns Thread

by BooMan
Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 04:38:39 PM EST

Here's a link to the Wisconsin county sites. Here's the CNN site for the Wisconsin returns. If you find a better accumulator, but a link in the thread. As far as I can tell, turnout was a little depressed in the morning because of ice on the roads and extreme cold. Turnout was reported as highest around college campuses. I can't predict the outcome, although I would have preferred higher turnout in the morning hours. At the same time, Obama has the more committed voters, so anything that creates an obstacle to voting probably favors him.

One thing I don't want to hear is that Obama didn't win by enough. There are two battles tonight. One is for the most delegates and that is the most important measure of success. The other is for the popular vote, and whoever wins it, wins it.

I also have no idea what will happen in Hawaii.

Wisconsin Returns Thread | 129 comments (129 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (4.00 / 2)

As a former resident of Northern Minnesota, trust me... Unless it's the "blizzard of the century" with absolute white-out conditions, these people go about their business as usual. The cold temps and ice don't even phase them. They'll get out and vote if they have any motivation for their candidate - and yes, this would favor Obama.

One thing that's been bugging me about TV political "analysis" of Wisconsin voters - it all sounds so wrong to me. They say the demographics favor Hillary because these people are white, working class - and that favors Hillary. Now that's some deep analysis. Just look at their neighbors Minnesota, North Dakota and Iowa. Who did they favor? Obama - in a big way. They look around and they notice that one of these politicians actually runs an "honest" campaign and excites the young folks - the future. That's pretty powerful stuff to these folks. Honesty - no mud slinging, lies or fear tactics - is the way to win them over.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:11:50 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Meet Jason, typical (as I remember them) Wisconsin Democratic voter. In this interview with the Obama campaign, he points out one issue that I never cared about much but most of the locals do - gun ownership - is the issue that gets Republicans the votes. Otherwise, they would vote Democratic.

What I'm most interested in seeing tonight in the exit polls is the number of Republican men who chose to vote for Obama, rather than a Republican.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:08:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

that to me is the measure of electability : how many Republican men who are disgusted with the GOP would be willing to vote either Clinton or Obama.

In all my anecdotal posts over at my blog, all the examples I've come across is of Republican men wanting Obama over any other candidate ---and this was waaaaaay before ANYBODY had declared their candidacies.

Blogueando @ culturekitchen.com

by liza (nyc.blogdiva@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:39:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

hi liza! (none / 0)

great to bump into you over here at the Frog Pond

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:41:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: hi liza! (none / 0)

LOL!

I stalk Martin.

He's afraid of me but not enough to put out a restraining order.

Blogueando @ culturekitchen.com

by liza (nyc.blogdiva@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:48:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: hi liza! (none / 0)

you can always pacify him with beer.

or another Giants Superbowl win :)

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:51:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

One of the biggest lies (none / 1)

Is how Clinton has the white blue-collar worker sewn up. The TV and newspapers tell American that Obama does well with rich, college educated whites. Yet, we see the blowouts in Minnesota, Idaho and North Dakota and we are supposed to believe that all those northern and midwestern states just happen to have a lockdown on all the rich, college educated whites in America? We're supposed to by the fantasy that there are no blue collar workers in Idaho or North Dakota?

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:28:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: One of the biggest lies (none / 0)

PREACH!

Blogueando @ culturekitchen.com

by liza (nyc.blogdiva@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:40:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (4.00 / 5)

I was out the door at 6:30 AM this morning and I was just fine. It's cold, but this is Wisconsin. Extreme cold starts around -25, not 5.

"Nobody can give you freedom. Nobody can give you equality or justice or anything. If you're a man, you take it." - Malcolm X

by Woodpecker on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:19:22 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Don't older voters tend to vote early in the day? If so, any benefit there would seem to go Obama's way, correct? By contrast, don't young people tend to vote later?

by RollaMO on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 04:42:36 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I can see no returns online... you are seeing early returns?? Please feed THE HUNGER and post here..

Declaring the bottom is the only way back up..

by anarchronarchist (mincers (-at-) hotmail (-dot-) com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:05:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I got nothing, but this is interesting:
http://www.rawstory.com/news/mochila/Early_Wis_exit_poll_highlights_02192008.html

by RollaMO on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:22:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

Yeah, it's cold up here (St.Paul, MN, represent'n!), but that's no big deal. It's how we roll.

I will be very surprised if Hil manages to even keep it very close.

The more control, the more that requires control. This is the road to chaos. -Frank Herbert, The Dosadi Experiment

by chimneyswift on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:23:28 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

What's with the polls?

a one day wonder - go figure
Yesterday Gallup had Obama up nationally. Today his lead vaporized.

but SurveyUSA, not sure their track record, has Obama gaining in Ohio as Hillary's lead shrinks

btw, the last few days. Obama has been campaigning in Ohio.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:32:45 PM EST

Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

the NYT has a pretty good results site HERE that's worth checking out as results start to come in.

they typically break it down to county level with interactive maps.

no info as of now.

the revolution will not be televised...

by dada on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:41:17 PM EST

Went around 5 p.m. to vote, expecting a crowd (none / 1)

and there wasn't. Seems as though more people were coming over to vote though, since this is about the time people get off work.

I've always been lucky to be near walking distance of any polling place; they're either around the corner or in the next block. It didn't take long. In fact, it took more time to walk over. You just connect someone's name to your vote, then feed it into some kind of insta-compute machine.

There were no other propositions or people running for office to really make people stand in lines.

Was 8 degrees in Mad City when I went out, but the sun has just gone down, and I still have on my knee-length Timberland boots bought straight from 125th Street in Harlem. I think the O man's may do it in all three states tonight.

I may murder Tweety before the night's over, though.

An untypical Negro

http://thisblksistaspage.wordpress.com

by blksista (gab1954@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 07:39:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Went around 5 p.m. to vote, expecting a crowd (none / 1)

OMG, I hope you're right! Of course, I was nervous about Maryland for both his race and Donna Edwards'. I always assume the worst, which isn't a good plan for life, but prudent in campaigns.

Can't hear ya, Peach!

by AP on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:37:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

From what people were saying over in the discussions at DKos, the greater mass of voters tend to come at lunch and in the afternoon/evening, after work (and classes). So they didn't seem concerned by the apparent low turnout early in the day.

Guess it's a wait and see....

Hawai'i returns won't start coming in until after midnight-1am EST, sounds like.

Keith Olbermann speaks for me.

by JanetT in MD on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 05:45:49 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I've a bad feel about tonight. Clinton went dirty at last minute. Dropped a mailer full of distortions...as she did in NH.

I'm looking for Clinton fatigue to set in, and that she gets whipped in every contest.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:31:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I'm feeling a bit nervous.

As an aside, at TPM they have an image of a direct mail piece that Hillary sent out in Wisconsin hitting Obama on the Present votes in the Illinois legislature.

This looks like the same piece of direct mail she sent out in Missouri and I remember being completely unimpressed with it. Direct mail needs to have a clear message that people see before they toss it in the trash. Take a look at it. It is just covered with print. Whoever she's using to design this crap, I would fire them and get somebody else.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:27:42 PM EST

New Hampshire too (none / 0)

Isn't it the same mailer that she sent out in New Hampshire that now has large swaths of women in NH pissed at her for lying?

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:30:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Hampshire too (none / 0)

Could be. I never saw the NH mailer. But when it arrived I looked closely at it because I knew there had been a New Hampshire mailer. That's when I realized it was horribly designed.

Of course I also remember thinking that Hillary didn't have a clue about Missouri demographics. There is a huge constitutuency of Democrats in Missouri who are pro-life and another huge constitutuency who are pro choice but would never dream of admiting it for fear of excommunication. So direct mail about choice is never a winner in Missouri.

Given that environment we do, however, understand how 'present' votes on issues regarding choice could be a viable strategy.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 06:58:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Some good early exits... (none / 0)

Al Giordano over at The Field points to some early exit polls released by CBS online and did a little math:

When it says that 57 percent of the voters are women and are voting 51 percent for Obama and 49 percent for Clinton, and that 43 percent of the voters are men and are voting 61 percent for Obama and 35 for Clinton, you can take out a calculator and add it all up:
Obama: 29.07 + 26.23 = 55.3 percent
Clinton: 27.93 + 15.05 = 42.98 percent
In electoral politics, a landslide is defined as a victory of 10 points or more. That would be a lead of 12.32.

Of course the post is named Caveat Emptor, but...

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:12:01 PM EST

Re: Some good early exits... (4.00 / 2)

Whoa...that was pretty interesting and some of my thoughts were confirmed. People are voting for Clinton just because she's a woman and because she's white. I've been reading these Clinton-supporting white women all over the internet and they all say the same thing, "People would rather vote for a black man than a woman." I never see Obama supporters mention that they prefer a black man over a woman, so I always wondered where it came from. After a while, I just figured it was their inherent racism and the more they talked, the more it came out. I mean anyone who can willingly believe that the word "periodically" is sexist, yet pretends that they don't see racism in 5 weeks worth of comments, clearly has other issues they need to deal with.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:35:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Some good early exits... (none / 0)

Maybe it's a secret desire kind of thing: They envy Obama because they're attracted to him. Black guys do have a reputation, you know. ;)

I kid, I kid.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to you country.

by Drew J Jones (blahblahblah@blahblahblah.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:48:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh, Geeze... (none / 0)

...do NOT get me started!

OK, a little bit: When I hear this type of thing, I don't hear It's time for a woman, I hear I can't believe you'd vote for a Black man over a White woman. That's what I felt when I read Steinem's hit piece (there's another article in the Globe that talked about the "Catch 22" of Clinton's run and I don't even know why I bothered). It was just a slap in the face.

But what REALLY floors me is how Hillary Clinton, who is the de facto incumbent because of her husband, somehow makes a feminist statement.

Lying about his efforts to protect choice in Illinois--is THAT a feminist statement??

Signing off on a war in Iraq so she can look "tough"--is THAT a feminist statement?

Oh Lord, I'm too sick to go on. I have an upper respiratory infection that I caught before it became bronchitis. Ew. Not fun. Let me just crawl into bed. I may follow the thread by CrackBerry.

Can't hear ya, Peach!

by AP on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:50:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Some good early exits... (none / 0)

Yup.

Two words : Gloria Steinem.

That Op/Ed still stings for being the example of exactly that.

Blogueando @ culturekitchen.com

by liza (nyc.blogdiva@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:47:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Some good early exits... (none / 0)

Well, I heard at TalkLeft that Clinton expects to lose by 20 because what with all the students in Madison Obama has a big support group with all the plagarists there.

(a little joke)

by Bob In Pacifica on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:22:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Apparently there's a lunar eclipse tonight. I hope it's a sign of Hillary's campaign in eclipse. ;)

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:53:18 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Mary are you sure? I thought it was tomorrow night between 7:00 and 8:00 pm.

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:57:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

You're right. Blame Orange. Somebody had a diary up about it and he's wrong - it's tomorrow.

Cheap symbolism anyway.

How's your household doing? Recovering?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 08:59:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Yep we're almost all feeling better. Thanks.

I read somewhere they might shoot down the satellite tomorrow or Thursday. I kept hoping we'd get an eclipse with a little light show, but they said it would be over the pacific so we won't be able to see anything. Oh well. :)

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:01:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I was hoping they'd shoot it down over New York -- just for some excitement ;)

(Kidding of course. Love all the New Yorkers here. Really.)

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:03:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

(Kidding of course. Love all the New Yorkers here. Really.)

Yep, but St. Louis is really the best city isn't it? ;)

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:07:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Well, of course. heh

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:08:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

My nerves! I don't know if they can take the regular abuse through the end of primary season ;)

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:01:31 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I know!

I was so glad that I was busy today so I didn't have to worry.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:02:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I was busy, too, but my big boss is a Hillary supporter and we've been having nonstop political smack-talking the past couple of weeks. O:--) It's much better than doing it online. heh

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:04:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

My office neighbor (and the head of my department) is supporting Obama, as is one of the older partners I work with all the time. We spend every morning analyzing the race. I don't know of any big Hillary supporters in our office.

We do have a superdelegate though. He's playing it very close to the vest.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:06:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

exit polls showing Obama won both men and women. Up big...leading as by CNN

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

those Hillary supporters are fanatical almost like a cult.

by americanforliberty on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:17:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Hi Manny.

It is a long way off isn't it?

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:02:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

Hi Family Man. I need to figure out which candle to light so St. McCain ends up humiliated in the general election, resigning his Senate seat in utter defeat.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:06:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

When you find that candle let me know. I want to light one too.

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:08:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Wouldn't that entail burning it at both ends? I've always heard you couldn't do that.

by no3reed on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Well you can, but not for long periods of time. :O

Mundane Doesn't Describe It

by Family Man (FamilyMan1atbellsouthdotnet) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

You Mexicans know nothing about black magic! You have to leave it all the brujo work to Puerto RIcans, don't you ... All you have to do is get a SIETE POTENCIAS candle and pray to Elegua, the trickster and troublemaker. He'll fuck up St. McCains road to the White House if you just spray a little rum on him and light him a candle ;)

Blogueando @ culturekitchen.com

by liza (nyc.blogdiva@gmail.com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:55:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

you underestimate the Apache blood that runs in these veins!

(laughing hard at your comment)

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:57:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

CNN calls it for McCain in Wisconsin.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:01:49 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

MSNBC is indicating that exit polls are overwhelmingly in favor of Obama. The polls have been closed for a full two minutes now and they can't call it yet??? sheesh!

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:03:37 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

CNN just said basically the same thing. Exit polls show him with a lead.

sigh.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:04:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

The early, incomplete exit polls I saw were weird. They appeared to have almost no blacks, Hispanics or senior citizens in them voting Democratic. I suspect that they don't trust them for a projection until some of the actual returns show the trend. So they are saying it's "too early" to call.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:09:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

McCain is giving his victory speech. Woo. and also Hoo.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:05:43 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I went to a luncheon yesterday -- lots of little old lady Democrats. I felt very young. The speaker was Paul Glastris, the editor of the Washington Monthly and he was talking about being a political speechwriter.

Someone asked him to analyze McCain's speaking style. He was ... polite.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:07:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I still say (none / 0)

McCain reminds of that authority figure in school who's Telling You Stuff For Your Own Good, but really has no idea what he's saying and isn't saying anything relevant to your life.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I still say (none / 0)

yep, like a crabby grandpa. "In my day, young lady ..."

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:14:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I still say (none / 0)

"Hey kid! GET OFF OF MY LAWN!"

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:18:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I joined a new gym in a fairly wealthy neighborhood and since I go during the day when the young folks are at work, I'm the only woman there under the age of 60. I am an absolute goddess in the locker room.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:13:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Well .. of course ;)

Aphrodite the goddess of love and beauty.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:15:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Me and my Y (none / 0)

I go to the Y and I go to the Easy Does It Class and most of the time I'm the youngest person there by 31 years. The only downfall is that they all have decided that they're my mom. I seriously get chided for not wearing a jacket.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:16:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

His wife - TOO much Botox.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:11:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

"I will make sure Americans are not deceived by an eloquent but empty call for change" - St. McCain in a direct barb at Obama. BLECH! Perhaps Senator Crypt Keeper is an appropriate nickname, after all.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:09:15 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

What are the odds he dies peacefully in his sleep of old age during the campaign season. 10-1 against?

"Have you no sense of decency, sir. At long last, have you left no sense of decency?" -- Boston Attorney Joseph Welch, taking down Sen. Joseph McCarthy.

by BostonJoe on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:10:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

hi notBostonnotJoe, those odds look accurate to me. his mother is out on the campaign trail with him...

McCain is wearing his Fundie Costume today - lots of apocalyptic language regarding the scaaaaaary terrorists wielding weapons of mass distruction

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

he repeated it because he lost his place when they applauded lol!

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:10:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Why do Republicans have problems reading teleprompters?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (4.00 / 2)

Delete the word "teleprompters" from your question. Now look at it. Are you still puzzled?

by no3reed on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:14:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

lol!

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:15:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

McCain generates such excitement. Just look at this reaction:

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:11:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I've hear McCain is doing well in the "Melancholy Dog" demographic.

"Have you no sense of decency, sir. At long last, have you left no sense of decency?" -- Boston Attorney Joseph Welch, taking down Sen. Joseph McCarthy.

by BostonJoe on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:13:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Exit polling at my house seemed to confirm that..

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:14:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

awwwwwww (none / 0)

those eyes and ears - i know all too well how effective they are at commanding obedience by their human servants.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:14:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: awwwwwww (none / 0)

I'm never good enough, Manny. Always a disappointment to Esperanza.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:22:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: awwwwwww (none / 0)

nah, she just knows how to lay the guilt trip on thick as all bassets lurve to do.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:25:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Does she still like the toilet paper roll or has she outgrown that phase?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:16:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

She's moved on from toilet paper to every single other thing in the house. Unlaundered underpants seem to be a favorite, and she likes to drop them in the middle of the living room when company is over.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:21:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Is it just me, or do all the republican wives look medicated?

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

They are, aren't they?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:12:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Cindy McCain (none / 0)

The Botox Queen, trying to start some shit with Michelle Obama. Does she want to go there?

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:14:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Stepford wives.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

MSNBC has Obama at 61%, but it's way early in the count.

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes

by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:17:08 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

They're projecting him the winner with less than 1% reporting. He did good.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:20:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

MSNBC calling it for him (none / 0)

My little girl just ran to me, "Winner! Barack Obama's the winner mama!".

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:22:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

not the youngest but the most experienced.

Gosh the crowd loved that. They really hate Hillary don't they?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:18:26 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 1)

MSNBuchananC calls Wisconsin for Obama!

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:19:04 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Damn. You youngsters are fast on your keyboards and such.

"Have you no sense of decency, sir. At long last, have you left no sense of decency?" -- Boston Attorney Joseph Welch, taking down Sen. Joseph McCarthy.

by BostonJoe on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:20:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

i may be a student of nonviolence, but don't mess with me in an old west gunfight :)

i enjoyed the fact that they interrupted the Pander Bear's doom and gloom blathering.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:27:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I just barely saw it. Mrs. BostonJoe has kicked me out of election-central. Banished to the Internets for news. But she clicked over for a minute. Dear soul.

So, I'm not getting any info. What will the Clinton spin be tonight. Didn't matter. Basically a draw. She's still inevitable. This is going to the convention floor. God. He splits Super Tuesday. And runs the table since then. What will it take for her to do what is best for all of us, and not just her. I swear, she would rather see President McCain than President Obama.

I seem to recall an old Reagan bromide. Something about the golden rule. Don't attack your own. The negativity from her just stinks.

"Have you no sense of decency, sir. At long last, have you left no sense of decency?" -- Boston Attorney Joseph Welch, taking down Sen. Joseph McCarthy.

by BostonJoe on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:30:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

wooohoo!

Nothing from CNN yet.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:20:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

CNN has just projected an Obama win.

by liberaljournal on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:22:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

MSNBC Calls it for Obama at 9:18 a.m.

"Have you no sense of decency, sir. At long last, have you left no sense of decency?" -- Boston Attorney Joseph Welch, taking down Sen. Joseph McCarthy.

by BostonJoe on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:19:33 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

saw that but CNN has it close!!!?

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:22:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Breaking News banner at CNN.Com now

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:24:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Somber scene at the Clinton campaign event.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:21:21 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

He pulled it off. Good. svp. Pass me a glass of wine.

McCain victory speech aimed at Obama on his "inexperience' the commander-in-chief and terror thingys, forgets that he wants us to be in Iraq for 100 yrs.

61% of Americans want out. We've lived in fear for 7 years that's why hope is resonating.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:29:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Seems like the "lunch bucket dems" jumped the Clinton ship.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:24:50 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

It's almost anticlimactic.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:25:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Come on, we still have South Dakota. Obama hasn't sewed up the entire region. Yet.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:28:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

oh yeah. I forgot about South Dakota. When is their .. whatever. Primary or caucus?

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:31:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

SD has a primary on June 3rd, 1st to last in the process.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:33:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Hawai'i is lunch time over?

as the candidate says "Your moment is Now"

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:32:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

What about the "tupperware in paper bag" Dems? Has there been a breakdown? And how come MSM always ignores the "Arby's special" Dems?

by Bob In Pacifica on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:02:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Or the (none / 0)

"Cup-a-soup from the vending machine" Dems.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 10:43:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Not such a mood of rejoicing at the Hillary event ...

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:27:22 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Latest Clinton camp excuse "We never really had a shot here because of all the Independents."

So it's not just blacks, the rich, the lunch-bucket crowd, the educated, red-staters, but now also independents.

Who's left? Some women I guess, but Obama took those in Wisconsin too.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:31:06 PM EST

Damn (none / 0)

Too bad they decided to go with the Muslim smears, they could have had that group.

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:35:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Hillary is speaking from a rally in Ohio - lets see if she continues her classy shtick of not congratulating Obama on victories.

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:31:25 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

so far she hasn't disappointed on that front.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:32:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

a must see the Clinton new videos "Yes We Will" and "I've worked night shifts"

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:36:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

HIllary is coming out to announce that Wisconsin is now an insignificant state.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:31:52 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Or she won't talk about Wisconsin at all, and her operatives will demean the state tomorrow.

by liberaljournal on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:33:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

she makes a habit of not congratulating Obama

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:38:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Yeah. They don't matter to Democrats... Bulshit. They're crucial to Democrats in November.

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:35:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Hillary looks defeated.

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:33:47 PM EST

Oh my (none / 0)

This group doesn't quite get the applause lines from Clinton. But this speech is even lamer hearing it than reading it today.

Are you shitting me?

She just lifted Obama's speech. The story of the mom sending in the check. The story of the Republican. Come on!

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:34:14 PM EST

Re: Oh my (none / 0)

I was just thinking that the crowd was missing it's applause cue.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:35:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Oh my (none / 0)

She's got to call them something clever...like Clintublicans

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:35:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

How about (none / 0)

Clintocons?

~~~THIS SPACE FOR RENT~~~

by fabooj (fabooj [at} mail [dot} com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:37:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: How about (none / 1)

That sounds like a robotic sex toy

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:38:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

She's gonna get cut off for Obama to speak!

by RandyH on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:36:47 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Whoa, Obama approaches the podium and Hill is still speaking...

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:36:57 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

heh, MSNBuchananC is getting ready to interrupt Hillary for Obama's speech

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:37:32 PM EST

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

CNN too

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:38:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

I hope he thanks Wisconsin for being so significant :)

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:39:03 PM EST

new thread? (none / 0)

should I start a new thread in the diaries? I think Drinking Liberally is underway in Philly...

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:40:00 PM EST

Re: new thread? (none / 1)

I'd follow you anywhere.

by maryb2004 on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:40:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: new thread? (none / 0)

good idea

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:40:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wisconsin Returns Thread (none / 0)

Aw, to be that six year old girl that he thanks....

by Second Nature (denn1214 at gmail) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:40:10 PM EST

[NEW THREAD] (none / 0)

BooMan is back: linkage here

Latino Político | "We are condemned to kill time, thus we die bit by bit." - Octavio Paz

by Man Eegee (man.eegee at gmail dot com) on Tue Feb 19th, 2008 at 09:43:09 PM EST

Wisconsin Returns Thread | 129 comments (129 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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