Booman Tribune

Reaction to FISA Compromise

by Steven D
Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 04:43:42 PM EST

Not all the Democrats in Congress are pleased by the FISA compromise that Steny Hoyer (Turncoat - Md) accepted today. Here's a CBS report detailing the reactions of several prominent Senators to what is a black stain on the Democratic leadership in the eyes of anyone who gives a damn about civil liberties:

(cont.)

Update [2008-6-19 18:46:51 by Steven D]: If so inclined, go to The Strange Bedfellows website and contribute a few bucks.

A broad alliance of strange bedfellows is now forming to support a campaign to fight the gutting of FISA (The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act) with the intent to work together on all civil liberties, constitutional rights and rule of law issues.

The ACLU is joining with activists from the Ron Paul campaign, represented by Break the Matrix, Rick Williams and Trevor Lyman, and civil liberties writer Glenn Greenwald of Salon, and leading liberal bloggers including, Jane Hamsher of firedoglake, Matt Stoller of Open Left, John Amato of Crooks and Liars, Howie Klein of Down with Tyranny, Digby, Josh Nelson of The Seminal and activist Josh Koster to tell Congress that we will not let them ignore the Constitution or give immunity to telecoms which deliberately broke our laws for years.

This group of Strange Bedfellows is mobilizing a broad-based left-right coalition of office holders and candidates, public interest groups and individuals who are devoted to preserving basic constitutional liberties to join in the fight. The goal is to work together to impede the corrupt FISA/telecom amnesty deal.

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) said Thursday he could not support a compromise on controversial electronic surveillance legislation, and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) is also cool to the proposal, making it unclear how much support the legislation will get in the Senate. [...]

“I have said since the beginning of this debate that I would oppose a bill that did not provide accountability for this administration’s six years of illegal, warrantless wiretapping,” said Leahy. “This bill would dismiss ongoing cases against the telecommunications carriers that participated in that program without allowing a judicial review of the legality of the program. Therefore, it lacks accountability measures that I believe are crucial.”

Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wisc.) said what other liberal Democrats are saying privately: Democrats "capitulated" to the White House.

"The proposed FISA deal is not a compromise; it is a capitulation," Feingold said. "The House and Senate should not be taking up this bill, which effectively guarantees immunity for telecom companies alleged to have participated in the president’s illegal program, and which fails to protect the privacy of law-abiding Americans at home. Allowing courts to review the question of immunity is meaningless when the same legislation essentially requires the court to grant immunity. "

Here's the link to Senator Feingold's complete statement on the FISA bill passed by the House. A statement from Obama opposing this "capitulation" by Democratic negotiators would be nice. Here's some other reactions from around the net:

The Nation

The phrase "cave-in" can get thrown around too often. Legislation requires compromise, and activists are pretty much never completely happy with anything that actually manages to make it through the proverbial sausage factory. That said, this FISA compromise really is a cave-in.

The ACLU

This bill allows for mass and untargeted surveillance of Americans' communications. The court review is mere window-dressing –- all the court would look at is the procedures for the year-long dragnet and not at the who, what and why of the spying. Even this superficial court review has a gaping loophole –- "exigent" circumstances can short cut even this perfunctory oversight since any delay in the onset of spying meets the test and by definition going to the court would cause at least a minimal pause. Worse yet, if the court denies an order for any reason, the government is allowed to continue surveillance throughout the appeals process, thereby rendering the role of the judiciary meaningless. In the end, there is no one to answer to; a court review without power is no court review at all.

The New Republic

It's pretty clear that the question of whether the telecoms end up having to pay damages is something of a sideshow. The lawsuits are such a big deal mainly because they appear to be the last remaining way of airing the details of the program in court and ascertaining whether it violated the law. (No individual can demonstrate that they were a target of the surveillance, and courts have ruled that such a demonstration is necessary in order for a plaintiff to have standing to challenge the program.) That's off the table now, which is quite disappointing. The government will at least have to document to the courts the assurances it provided to telecoms, which is a plus. But according to the text of the legislation (pdf--scroll down to page 91), the courts will be prohibited from releasing any documents whose publication the attorney general declares would threaten national security. So you can bet that none of them will ever see the light of day, and there will be no informed public debate on the legality of the program. All in all, the Democrats pretty much caved on the question of judicial review of the wiretapping program.

It must be bad if TNR calls it a cave-in by the Democrats.

And CQ Politics

is claiming it's all the fault of the Blue Dog Democrats.

A potential revolt by a group of Democrats pressed party leaders into compromising on a rewrite of electronic surveillance rules that could come to a House vote by week’s end, a top Democrat said Wednesday.

The Electronic Frontier Foundation

The current immunity language differs very little from the proposal that was debated in February and March, according to Kevin Bankston, a senior staff attorney at the Electronic Frontier Foundation -- which is arguing the leading case against the nation's telecoms.

"The current proposal is the exact same blanket immunity that the Senate passed in February and that the House rejected in March, only with a few new bells and whistles so that political spinsters can claim that it actually provides meaningful court review," Bankston said.

It appears we have three parties. The Republicans (who march in lock step regardless of whether they are considered centrist, radical or maverick), Liberal Democrats and Blue Dog Democrats. Actually, add another group to that list: Chickenshit Democrats. I think that covers it, don't you?



Display:
202-224-2854

Obama's office

Call them and tell them that he had better get off the fucking stick and TAKE A LEADERSHIP POSITION OPPOSING THIS UNCONSTITUTIONAL CRAP BILL.

by dataguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 05:05:24 PM EST
steven, just one final question: where were these strange bedfellows around the first of may when this "compromise" surfaced?

[l've already linked to a previous comment/diary by brendan it above, btw.]

why is it that demoRAT's...and progressives in particular...seem to have a DNA defect that blocks their ability to plan ahead and plot a cohesive strategy...so much of what transpires is "reactionary", and not pre-emptive.

it's not like nobody saw it coming.

my level of frustration and disdain for those in charge, top to bottom, has reached new highs today.

and on that note, l really gotta go.

laater

lTMF'sA...the revolution will not be televised...Peace

by dada on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 07:05:46 PM EST
Absolutely right re even TNR finding it a cave-in. That's nearly the DLC's publication.

Here are more contact numbers for Obama that have a better chance of getting action than his campaign number. Fax a copy of Steven's post to any of these!

Washington D.C. Office
713 Hart Senate Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20510
(202) 224-2854
(202) 228-4260 fax
(202 228-1404 TDD

Chicago Office
John C. Kluczynski Federal Office Building
230 South Dearborn St.
Suite 3900 (39th floor)
Chicago, Illinois 60604
(312) 886-3506
(312) 886-3514 fax
Toll free: (866) 445-2520
(for IL residents only)

Springfield Office
607 East Adams Street
Springfield, Illinois 62701
(217) 492-5089
(217) 492-5099 fax

Marion Office
701 North Court Street
Marion, Illinois 62959
(618) 997-2402
(618) 997-2850 fax

Moline Office
1911 52nd Avenue
Moline, Illinois 61265
(309)736-1217
(309)736-1233 fax

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes

by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 05:12:57 PM EST
Don't go to his campaign. I don't think they'll know what to do with it. This is a job for Obama the Senator, not Obama the campaigner, although if Obama the Senator speaks, people will hear Obama the President-In-Waiting.

I used the email form on his Senate webpage to point back to hs statement against FISA the last time the bill came around, on Feburary 12th. (You can find it if you go to obama.senate.gov and put FISA in the search box. It's the first thing that comes up.) I didn't even try the phones. They sound like they're all full, and I don't know if the Illinois offices will take my call, being as how I'm from Waashington.

I did call my representative's office (Jay Inslee) to let him know I wanted him to vote against FISA and the appropriations bill. I told the very kind staffer whose name I didn't bother to get that I liked several things about the appropriations bill, like the flood relief provision and the New GI Bill, but the war had to end sometime and the power of the purse seemed like the only way to do it. The staffer told me I wasn't the only person who'd called asking Inslee to vote "No" but didn't know whether he'd made any statement on the bills at this point.

"This is Barack Obama's party now." -- Chuck Todd

by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 05:25:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Crickets from Obama . . . .

He might as well be taking a huge piss all over the constitution.  I wonder if that is the visual aid Obama used the first day of con law to show his students his respect for the constitution.

Or maybe he should have ripped the 4th Amendment out of the constitution before beginning class.

Every other word out of his mouth re the constitution is bullshit.  His moral authority on constitutional issues is ZERO.  He failed a basic test of acting to defend the constitution.  He failed to uphold the constitution.  He violated his oath.  He showed he is a coward.  A moral midget.  There is no excuse for this behavior.

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 05:27:14 PM EST
What the hell is with you? You've been whining about this in a couple of threads now. This 'compromise' was only uncovered yesterday, I believe. Give it some time, the man is busy!

This diary by thereisnospoon is heading up the reco list at dKos just now:

I just called Senator Obama's office.  A very courteous staffer answered the phone immediately.

I mentioned that I was a precinct captain for the Obama campaign in California, that I was a caucus captain in Nevada who broke the story about the caucus shenanigans by the Clinton campaign.

I explained that I was extremely concerned about the FISA compromise currently being rammed through the House, and that it was very, very important to me that Senator Obama use his leverage to make a public stand against this capitulation.

The response was somewhat heartening:

"We hear you loud and clear.  The staff are literally reviewing the FISA issue as we speak.  You'll be hearing from us soon."


John McCain - Is not pro-choice
by ask on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:07:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What's with me is I'm mad.  Very mad.  That's what happens when one sees the party he has been a part of for most of his life have its last shred of dignity ripped of it.  And I'm rightly mad.  The Dems are caving in on one of the biggest civil liberties abuses in our country's history.  It's a travesty.  In plain sight.  

I'm also mad that so many of my allies, like you, are complete suckers.

Did you just hear about this two hours ago?  Were you born yesterday?

Obama is making a calculated effort to distance himself on this issue.  If he does the right thing it's because patriotic liberals stood up and fought for it.    It will not be because Obama wants to fight for it.

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:14:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"This 'compromise' was only uncovered yesterday, I believe."

no offense meant ask, but l've been paying attention, and you're wrong...this has been in the mill, openly, since early may...follow the bouncing ball

lTMF'sA...the revolution will not be televised...Peace

by dada on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:23:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hey dada,
see response to super, got to run, but back in a while.

John McCain - Is not pro-choice
by ask on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:49:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
ask,
 just to let you know that I don't consider you a sucker who was born yesterday :o).
But I do share SFhawkguy's anger and bewilderment at the passive response of too many of our allies.

Peace

by supersoling (colorsplash62@optonline.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:30:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hi ss,
Thanks, I was also taken a bit aback by the ad hominem.
Anyway, I am of course aware that this fight has been going on for some time and was beaten back before.
A new 'compromise' was attempted by Hoyer/Rockefeller - trying to sneak wording into the text, maybe I am imagining this, but I recall reading a diary on it - I think yesterday - on kos. I did a quick search for it now (no success), but have to head out. My point above was that he has a lot on his plate (new smear attempts every day) and will most likely soon make a statement. It is a bit presumptuous of us to decide his daily agenda.

John McCain - Is not pro-choice
by ask on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:47:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Climbing up? It's at the top of the list now.

I'm going to wait to see what happens. I should note that while I'm waiting, I called my representative's office, I left an email on Senator Obama's website referencing the February 12th FISA statement you may have seen me post earlier, and I emailed Keith Olbermann asking him to please cover this so more Americans would know what their Congress is trying to push behind their back.

And all this while I was doing my day job. So I'm doing what I can to try to take this off the table.

"This is Barack Obama's party now." -- Chuck Todd

by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:36:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It got there while I made the comment. When I first read it at 6.00 or so, it was not yet there.

John McCain - Is not pro-choice
by ask on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:48:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I know, that wasn't a slam on you or anything, that was a comment on how fast it was moving. :)

"This is Barack Obama's party now." -- Chuck Todd
by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 07:21:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I called Obama's office in DC and here in Chicago. Today I wrote him an e-mail, in which I basically told him that I suspect I may have been illegally wiretapped because I made a phone call to Afghanistan in 2003 or 2004.

Whatever Congress decision might be, I will pursue this once there is a "regime change" in this country. I also wrote to the whistle blower who first made public FBI's documents regarding my grandparents, and he replied that if I needed help declassifying any documents regarding my father, that he would help. fortunately, he is a FOIA "guru" (as I have read), a journalist and a lawyer. And I know that he will love helping me with the telecoms.

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)

by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 05:45:21 PM EST
So you're willing to give him a pass for violating the entire country's 4th amendment rights as long as he shows an interest in your family's records?

No wonder we get these coward Democrats that are afraid to stand up for the constitution.  Everyone is giving him a free pass and "hoping" that Obama miraculously fixes things when he's in office.  Talk about naive.  

At least I know where the Democratic party and my supposed allies stand.  They are cowards that have no interest in standing up for the constitution.  

Let's get back to the campaign of gaffes.  Quick, I heard McCain misspoke.  Everyone pile on and that way we can forget the unpleasantness of seeing Dems piss on the constitution.  

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:09:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So you're willing to give him a pass for violating the entire country's 4th amendment rights as long as he shows an interest in your family's records?

I don't think that's what cruz said, only that he/she intends to pursue this particular violation regardless.  There was no mention of giving Obama a pass by cruz.

Obama is a Patriot

by Steven D on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:22:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I may have jumped the gun.  Sorry Cruz.

In the back of my mind I'm also thinking of those that are holding out hope that criminal charges will be brought in lieu of impeachment or congressional investigations after Obama takes office.

There is no justification for such hope.  It's irresponsible in any case.  Bush's crimes and culpability need to be argued directly to the American people--now.  If Obama intends to bring Bush to justice he needs to tell us exactly how he will do it.

by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:28:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If it happens, then we start from scratch. As far as I know, the president does not trump the Constitution. And neither does Congress, unless there is an ammendment.

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)
by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:41:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I am a he. Thanks StevenD

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)
by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:31:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Chalk it up to my poor memory.  I've probably seen that from you before, but after 50 . . . ;-)

Obama is a Patriot
by Steven D on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:35:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I know the feeling. (i'm 51)

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)
by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:37:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Me too.  Small world.

Obama is a Patriot
by Steven D on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:38:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
...young wippersnappers

by mainsailset on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 07:08:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"So you're willing to give him a pass for violating the entire country's 4th amendment rights as long as he shows an interest in your family's records?"

Say What? If I were you I would read it again: I never said I would give anybody a pass. Second, I mentioned my grandparents records SIMPLY BECAUSE THAT IS HOW I GOT IN TOUCH WITH SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THE HELL THEY ARE DOING. And, if I was not clear enough, HE IS A LWYER, who also offered to help (read SUE the telecoms and the government)

"No wonder we get these coward Democrats that are afraid to stand up for the constitution."

Let me ask you: what is it you are doing other than typing away??? (I will not make your mistake of being self righteous and assume you are not doing anything).  

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)

by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:30:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sorry for jumping on you.  I misread your comment.
by SFHawkguy on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:33:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's cool. Now I have to replace my head gasket :0)

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)
by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:38:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Do a compression test first ;o)
by supersoling (colorsplash62@optonline.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:48:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No need. I saw the smoke coming out of my ears.

If you want me to go back to the place that I was born, tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)
by cruz del sur (nicodk@sbcglobal.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:50:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Obama is losing me quickly.
The Constitution is a huge issue for me, especially my rights to free speech and against undue search and seizure.
If Obama will not stand up I will vote for someone who will.

The only reason i didn't leave the party a few months back is that Booman and Luam urged me to stay in so I could vote for him in the primary.

I did so, and it looks like all I got was another spineless DemocRAT who's too busy sermonizing about so-called deadbeat dads (a pariah population if there ever was one, and an easy target) to stand up for our rights.

Wheee. "Change." "Hope." what a pathetic load of self-serving bullshit.


John Mccain Called his wife WHAT??

by brendan on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:27:13 PM EST
I'm seeing a lot of this kind of hyperactive concern troll type behavior. Obama has not yet been made king. Right now he is little more than the presumptive Presidential candidate. Try to quantify his power.

Do you think that Hoyer doesn't know Obama's opinion on this? Do you think that everyone in Congress doesn't know Obama's opinion or how he voted. What do you want Obama to do? Threaten Hoyer? Publicly try to humiliate him? Then what happens when Hoyer goes ahead with his plan? Who's more powerful?

Should the blogosphere be working to stop this capitulation? You bet. Should a bunch of nervous nellies blame everything on Obama? Only if you expected Obama to have godlike powers. In which case maybe you should be sitting in a pew and not at a keyboard.

by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 09:13:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Should the blogosphere be working to stop this capitulation? You bet. Should a bunch of nervous nellies blame everything on Obama? Only if you expected Obama to have godlike powers. In which case maybe you should be sitting in a pew and not at a keyboard.

Rummy? Is that you?

by supersoling (colorsplash62@optonline.net) on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 10:18:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I flashed on a comedy bit that Al Franken did years ago regarding Rumsfeld being interviewed as he was boarding a helicopter to escape an approaching tidal wave.

My use of "You bet" is generational, not political.

by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 10:48:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well-said.  I come here because I don't usually get a tension headache while reading the comments, but this has been less true of late....
by eeblet (bethbudwig at g mail) on Fri Jun 20th, 2008 at 12:22:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I could see Barr as a legitimate protest vote.  However, I would never want to see a full bore libertarian agenda enacted.  It would be a disaster.

Obama is a Patriot
by Steven D on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:37:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Laura Rozen notes the CQ piece with this comment:

Worse than Nixon this is

A knowledgeable friend comments, "It's worse than Nixon because it extends [the argument that if the president says it's legal, it's legal] to cover non-government, private actors. Nixon limited himself to government actors."

No to incumbents in '08. Clean out the rats.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 06:38:09 PM EST
I am so disgusted with the pussy democrats. What the F are they scared of? Telecom Lobbyists? I guess we all got caught up in Obamania and expected him to put his stamp on the Democratic party. He showed glimpses of leadership but where is he at?

What if Obama actually wants the law so when he is in power? I do not believe it but it could be a possibility. This bill gives the president whatever he wants on spying with ZERO judicial review.

We have been looking for a true leader in the Democratic party and we finally thought we found one but a core issue that is SUPER big deal for the base, they get shit on. Obama did not write the bill, he did not capitulate but he sure is not making any public statements about it yet.

Hell, I am more pissed that 180 bill more for wars and no one says peep.

I keep getting Obama emails and respond, I will never give you money again until I see some leadership on this bill. It comes back but every email today about money just pisses me off.  I have not felt this bad about one of my favorite pols since Senator Harkin voted for the war in 2002.

"The heart of darkness is the president. Nobody knows what he thinks, even the people who work for him."

by Mac G on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 10:05:45 PM EST

"Persons immune from lawsuits include "Anyone" who "provid[ed] assistance to an element of the intelligence community . . . in connection with intelligence activity involving communications that was (i) authorized by the President during the period beginning on September 11, 2001, and ending on January 17, 2007 and (ii) designed to prevent or detect a terrorist attack, or activities in preparation of a terrorist attack, against the United States and (B) the subject of a written request or directive . . . indicating that the activity was (i) authorized by the President; and (ii) determined to be lawful."

The above statement leads me to believe that the amnesty provided, also includes torturers, since the president determined that it was lawful in the view that the torture was committed "to detect any activities in preparation of a terrorist attack".
Am I way off the mark here, or does this bill cover all their asses for more than the crime of telling the tele-coms it was legal to spy, but also that it was legal to torture. The WAR COUNCIL made it so, no?

The difference between theists and atheists is that the atheists don't set the theists on fire for refusing to agree with them.

by KNUCKLEHEAD on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 10:15:40 PM EST
Let me say it once again. The Democrats are afraid. They are afraid of the CIA, the NSA, military intelligence and the rest of the conglomerate that have controlled this country for the last forty-five years. Now do you understand?
by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Jun 19th, 2008 at 10:52:25 PM EST


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We listened to PEN American Center's "State of Emergency" and found 1940s books by Curzio Malaparte only at Alibris. (Selection (MP3) excerpted from "The Skin.")

Alibris - Books You Thought You'd Never Find
Banned Books * Are you a fan of Film Noir, Art House, Documentaries or Hong Kong Action? * Searching for a long-lost children's book or a first printing of Miles Davis' Kind of Blue on vinyl? Find it at Alibris!

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