Booman Tribune

If It's Biden

by BooMan
Fri Aug 22nd, 2008 at 11:51:35 PM EST

Jake Tapper of ABC News is reporting that a Secret Service detachment has been sent to Joey Biden's house in Delaware and that the Biden clan is congregating there. I have to admit that there are a lot of signs pointing in the direction of Joe Biden. But, perhaps for that reason, I'm still skeptical. Maybe a little detective work solved the case here, but I think it's very possible that it is all by design. After all, where is the surprise when that text message comes if everyone already has it figured out?

One thing is definitely true, though. If it is not Joe Biden he has certainly allowed himself to be used in this subterfuge. Perhaps Biden has already been offered the State Department? I don't know, but I'm guessing Biden has something in his hip pocket.

I mentioned this earlier in the week, but if Biden moves out of the senate to either State or the Naval Observatory, he will make room for Chris Dodd to take over the Foreign Relations committee. And that, in turn, could lead to Jack Reed taking over the Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs. Simply pulling Biden out of the senate will allow Obama to set himself up nicely to get key allies in place.

Anyway, for progressives concerned about Biden, this would be a nice consolation prize.

Update [2008-8-23 0:59:17 by BooMan]: (CNN) — Sen. Barack Obama has selected Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware as his running mate on the Democratic ticket for the White House, two Democratic sources told CNN.



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Yeah - I'm seeing the same story on CNN. And Biden is the biggest remaining name out there. And he does need an older white male with foreign policy experience. So we'll see. And I love what you note - that DOES set up some strong allies, or so we hope.

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes
by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 12:02:27 AM EST
I think the Obama campaign saw how McCain's pro-war stance over Georgia/S. Ossetia/Russia boosted McCain's poll numbers and decided to bring on a militarist with a big mouth, Biden, to turn the polls back to Obama's favor.

In any case, it's sad to see that militarism wins. This is one sad, pathetic, and bratty nation. Either that, or the polls are completely artificial constructions, like our presidential election vote results.

Another sad day in the USA.

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by Isis on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 09:10:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Take a look before you write off Biden.  He's not my first choice but I agree with BooMan, Biden is a good consolation prize; like winning a silver or bronze medal in the Olympics.  

His foreign policy views are well balanced. On Georgia/S.Ossetia, don't blame Biden..what is little known is that Congress, without debate, passed the NATO Freedom Consolidation Act making Georgia our NATO ally!?!

That's what sad. Laws of untold consequences get passed by attachment to Bills without debate!

Biden's working class background is a plus. His foreign policy views are less military force reliant - more cooperative  ...and the McCain-Rove-Schmidt shits can't touch him on the money thing.

Biden will not allow the ticket to be swift boated in this cycle. GOP won't be allowed to use national security as a weapon. Biden's son has just deployed to Iraq.  He'll want to bring him home. Pronto.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 10:21:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Isis, people should measure Biden as the actual power structure of Washington. The Military, or the Military-Industrial Complex, runs the show. The easiest way to run the show is to control the Presidency. Obama may be untrustworthy to the MIC, and they may like McCain better, but they may not be able to steal this election so Biden at least provides some insurance.
by Bob In Pacifica on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 10:56:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

via Huffpost

Watch these Video clips of Joe Biden on various policy issues

He's dead right on Af/Pakistan.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 11:38:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
On 20-20 hindsight (projection?) it painfully obvious why Biden is the VP choice -- it's what he brings to the campaign table.

To quote a friend, Barak Obama is painfully thoughtful -- Joe Biden is blunt and direct. Where Obama contemplates and analyzes, Biden cuts to the quick.

Joe Biden has the right stuff to lay the Noun/Verb/POW smackdown on Cindy McCain's hubby -- where Obama waxes eloquent, Biden swings the big wood.

The rest of the Biden baggage, Obama can live with . . .

by ck on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 12:40:47 AM EST
jon alter at newsweek thinks the same thing:

... If it is Biden, the three biggest advantages he brings will be his ostensible shortcomings:

His mouth: Biden would fulfill the job of attack dog that is the first requirement for a vice presidential candidate, and that is especially important now for Obama. If Jabbering Joe is responding to John McCain's shots with memorable one-liners of his own, Obama can stay where he wants to be--above the fray. And if Biden says something off-the-wall that sticks in everyone's mind, all the better, as long as it's about McCain and not Obama or people who work in convenience stores or otherwise loosen Biden's tongue. The worry with Biden is that he just can't help himself. Obama may hope that he just can't stop himself from saying, say, that McCain is a hothead who shouldn't have his finger on the button. Obama can then denounce his No. 2's intemperate remarks even as they sink in. This is what veep candidate were put on earth to do. Same on the Republican side...



the revolution will not be televised...Peace
by dada on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:19:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm giddy to see Joe Biden in a debate with whoever McSame picks. Get your popcorn ready!!!

"We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further." - Richard Dawkins
by halo0 (philiott at gmail dotcom) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:19:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
i have to agree with much of this. biden is witty too and a very smart man who goes more from the hip; obama is much more cerebral. he certianly made some of the more memorable quips and insightful comments during the campaign. I thought though that since the northeast was pretty well sewn up it didn't make much geographical sense to choose him.

personally though i must say that i'm disappointed that there isn't a woman on the ticket.

by michael72 on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:09:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
From the Nation magazine:
Biden maintains 100 percent ratings from Planned Parenthood, the League of Conservation Voters, Citizens for Tax Justice, the Children's Defense Fund and the NAACP; and 93 percent from the AFL-CIO--these numbers are every bit as liberal as his competitors'.

Plus I can already see the new slogan: "Change We Can Believe In. Experience You Can Count On."

Game on.

by existenz on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 02:57:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Where is my text?!?! I was actually thinking it would be pretty hilarious if he texted everyone at about 3AM...

"We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further." - Richard Dawkins
by halo0 (philiott at gmail dotcom) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:02:32 AM EST
He did, Eastern time. My phone was beeping so I finally got up to watch the coverage. But oh, I need to get back to sleep....

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes
by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 05:28:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I just woke up! Have to turn on the television. Lisa this will be good for the Democrats. Obama's first decision is a sound one.

"We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals; now we know that it is bad economics;" - Franklin Delano Roosevelt
by Salunga on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:21:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Hey, anyone but Hillary suits me just fine. Now lets go rip McSameillionare.
by NancyImpeachBush on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:02:42 AM EST
by Oui on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:07:36 AM EST
And of course putting Biden in at State or some other appointed post would have the same effect in the Senate as making him veep.  You say as much in the post of course.  I think whatever tea leaves we see today, the head-fake is going to be in play all the way up to the end.  

If it's not Biden though, who else would create the kind of surprise and enthusiasm that would live up to all the suspense?  Hillary would be almost shocking.  Next to that, all I can think of is maybe Schweitzer, and I'm not really sure that he has the national name recognition to live up to the drama.  It'd make me happy though.

'Course, I can live with Biden plenty fine.

The Wages of Sin is about $5.15 an Hour

by hz on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:08:29 AM EST
The other names that would generate a lot of "surprise and enthusiasm"? Let's see... Al Gore?

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by mrboma on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 03:10:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

It's Biden for VP and I can hear the Leftiness Shmoo Chorus warming up in the background already.

He's too old!!!

He's too gaffey!!!

He's a racist!!!

He thinks Obama is inexperienced!!!

He talks too much!!!

He's a warmonger!!!

He's the Senator from MBNA!!! From Credit Card Central!!!

Etc. etc. etc.


Yup.

You know Biden's only real fault as a politician?

He sometimes speaks the truth when he shouldn't.

He was a stutterer in his youth. His nickname was "Dash" because he'd give up and not finish sentences. Stuttering is indicative of inner conflict. He beat it, and as a result sometimes his inner censor doesn't kick in when it should.

More power to him.

Truthette's Syndrome.

I hope he goes out and kicks some deserving asses.

Obama is an outside shooter and passer. He needed a rebounder, a defensive guy with a good inside game.

I think he won the election today. Had he picked a colorless middle-of-the-roader like Bayh he would have lost. Now we have some fire on the ticket. Some contrast. Mr. Outside and Mr. Inside. Hot and cool. Obama can play the "I'm being presidential" game while Biden can kick some ass.

What's that?

Obama and Biden have their faults?

Yup.

So do you and I.

Let us pray.

ANYTHING would be better than a continuation of the last 8 years.

Anything.

I played at one of the first Butch inauguration parties in 2001. It was a MOST depressing gig. The celebrants were mean-spirited Young Republican types. No real joy, just acquisitiveness, fear and greed leaching out from underneath their masks. I hope to play at Obama's celebration. Musicians get to see the crowd at a party in a special way. How they dance, how they act when they're a little inebriated and the truth shows through. When they drop their masks.

Betcha the gig will be a ball.

Betcha.

Later...

AG


Goodness had nothing to do with it, dearie.-Mae West

by Arthur Gilroy (arthurgilroy<at>earthlink.net) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:29:16 AM EST
I'm with you, Arthur.  I think they'll complement each other nicely.

I hope you play at their party in January!

by CabinGirl on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:41:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

AG,I agree we need to kick some asses. Biden brings fire power.

He's a good pick.  I'm encouraged with Biden's foreign policy outlook, specifically on Pakistan - the most dangerous place in the world. While we're distracted with our eyes wide shut, Pakistan is about to blow up alongside Afghanistan.

Lastly, he will tell the GOP they do not own patriotism or national security.

Well, "You can't vote for war and disown the results"

by idredit on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 09:07:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And go to bed, BooMan! Word now is they won't announce until morning. CNN was thinking 7am eastern. I know Obama won't blow off the critical West like that. I suspect he'll announce just before noon (eastern) to get maximum audience share for his announcement

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes
by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 12:03:32 AM EST
Well, so much for what I know. ;-) He blew off everybody, announcing when most were in bed...

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes
by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 05:29:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
ooooh, i likes when you talks smart like this.

I AM living in interesting times.
by greenbird on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 12:43:13 AM EST
and the other thing to note on Foreign Relations is that Hagel is retiring and Coleman could be in trouble. The seniority on the other side could be gutted. And Lugar will work with Obama anyway.

Also, Obama will be out--so who goes in? Warner? Shaheen? Franken? :)

by along on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:23:33 AM EST
That's the one "worse than Hillary" choice out of all those that have been mentioned. This is another Lieberman, a choice that will lose votes.

Quite honestly, if it was McCain vs. Biden, I would vote for McCain, and I hate the thought of McCain in the whitehouse.

I can't vote for McCain.

I can't vote for Biden.

I live in Washington, which has a top two ballot, so I can't even vote for a third party.

I guess I'm not voting for president this year.

by david anderson on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:43:06 AM EST
and state/local contests. I believe the third parties will still be on the ballot for federal (i.e. Presidential) offices, although I could be mistaken.

So you will have the opportunity to do what you feel you have to do.

I'm doing a panel on Blogs and the Media at VCon, Oct 4, Vancouver BC

by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 05:26:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
David,

Don't make Phil Graham right.

If you don't vote for Obama you're helping to bring on Armageddon.

by Cee on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 10:12:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Is anyone else curious how they found out?  I mean they ruined the whole text message thing.  It's like the TradMed was pissed that they were going to get scooped.  Did someone from the Secret Service tell them?  If so, that's not good.
by Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:46:02 AM EST
I am certain that someone just got very very rich. CNN paid big bucks.A lower level campaign staffer that knew they had nothing to lose. Dumb shit.
by NancyImpeachBush on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 01:56:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Could be, could not be. I have no idea.

As far as I could tell there were two big "tells" last night:

  1. The charter plane from Midway airport in Chicago to somewhere in Delaware -- the only charter flight out of the Chicago area that night

  2. The Secret Service being rushed to Biden's house

At any rate it looks like it could easily have been a case of good, old-fashioned shoe-leather reporting. You know, like the kind the media usually avoids. Would that they had been this diligent in the runup to Iraq.

I'm doing a panel on Blogs and the Media at VCon, Oct 4, Vancouver BC
by Omir the Storyteller (omir.the.storyteller -CAT- gmail -DOG- com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 05:29:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
but I would bet on my life that it wasn't a "real" journalist that dug it up. I don't think we have but one or two of those left.
by NancyImpeachBush on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 12:24:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank god! Now we can stop all the useless and boring speculation and get to something worth talking about, perhaps.

And by the way, Biden doesn't help Obama at all with anyone who understands that it is not the right of ignorant United States politicians or anyone else to decide to divide Iraq into three geo-ethno-sectarian pieces that have never existed before at any time in history. If this is the best the Democrats have to offer as a foreign policy expert, heaven help the world.

As far as I am concerned, the only thing Obama has going for him is the fact that McCain is scarier even than Bush.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 02:37:48 AM EST
I am curious as to what your solution is to the sectarian animosities of Iraq.  Seems to me that the Shia - Sunni difficulties have been of rather long duration. And how does one factor the Kurds in with their deep desire for a nation state?

All members of the frog pond are special.
by Daredevil Don on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 07:37:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, I was taught about these conflicts when I was in high school 12 yrs ago....
by eeblet (bethbudwig at g mail) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 10:20:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Then you were taught nonsense when you were in high school 12 years ago.
by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:38:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I was taught about the HISTORICAL conflicts between Sunni & Shia Muslims, and the marginalization of the Kurds:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunni-Shia_relations
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Kurdistan

Please, give your fellow tribbers the benefit of the doubt - or be kind if we're wrong.  Your kneejerk condescension does little for your causes.

by eeblet (bethbudwig at g mail) on Sat Aug 30th, 2008 at 10:22:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
  1. The "sectarian animosities of Iraq" are political, not sectarian.

  2. The Shi`a Sunni "difficulties" are not of "long duration" at all. That is an ignorance-based piece of self-serving nonsense that has become received truth as a result of incessant repetition. On the contrary, those "difficulties" are of very recent origin, are politically, not religiously based, and are the direct result of the United States' empowerment of divisive and extremist elements on both sides. They will gradually end if the Americans get out and stop stirring the pot.

For centuries Sunnis and Shi`as have lived together comfortably, cooperating, doing business together, and intermarrying (the intermarriage rate in Iraq is estimated at 30%). Iraq has no history of serious, widespread, or protracted sectarian conflict prior to 2003.

I have written about this here numerous times and at length. Some time ago I posted a diary here that in part addressed this subject. You can read it here if you are interested.

3) First, do not overestimate the Kurds' "deep desire" for a nation state. It is far more nuanced and complicated than you think, and it is far from universal. Many Kurds are proud of being Iraqi and want to remain so, despite heavy pressure from the two mafiosi war lords who are their "leaders". We saw evidence of this after Iraq's Asia Cup victory when a number of Kurds were arrested for displaying the Iraqi flag, which is outlawed by the war lords and their gangs of thugs.

Second, under no circumstances is this the right or the province of the United States to determine and put into place. It is something for Iraqis - Kurds, Arabs, Turkmens, Assyrians, Chaldeans, and "others" - to work out among themselves without interference from ignorant Americans acting in what they believe is their own interest.

And I would remind you also of, for example, the Basque's "deep desire" for a nation state that Spain has well satisfied for the great majority by making a compromise arrangement. By this method Spain satisfied all but the most extremist elements among the Basques and reduced the violence to the point that they considerable tolerable. There is no reason to believe that Iraqis could not accomplish the same thing if the will and the means were there.

And finally, on the subject of the Kurds supposed "deep desire" for a nation state, in that light, do you also suggest that the United States has the right to determine that Turkey should be divided into two parts, Turkish and Kurdish? You do know, don't you, that Turkish Kurds are the most oppressed and abused of all the Kurdish populations, and that Iraqi Kurds have practically had a picnic by comparison? I recommend the documentary film "Good Kurds, Bad Kurds". You can buy it online (google it), and I believe NetFlix has it. You will learn some things from it, I promise.

And finally, since you appear sympathetic with those wo have a "deep desire" for a nation state, I hope you support the right of the Palestinians to their nation state in the 22% of their birthright where they have been living under a criminally brutal and cruel occupation and land-grab by Israel.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:37:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
PS Iraqis NEVER used to ask each other if they were Sunni or Shi`a or whatever because they just didn't care. What Iraqis cared about was whether the person was a good, interesting, reliable human being.
by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:54:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It's Biden. Check the Obama website or the pictures Kos has put up, it's official.

Look, Biden is the least worst option of the surviving choices. If he wasn't going to pick Gore or Clark (and can't pick Edwards) then I suppose Biden would be good on some issues.

by MNPundit on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 03:26:32 AM EST
"Biden is the least worst option of the surviving choices."

Wow! What an endorsement!

Me? I am leaning toward Cynthia McKinney. With a hip hopper as her VP, at least there is some entertainment value, and I have come over the years to appreciate hip hop as an art form.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 03:48:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If Obama had picked Bayh Cynthia would have been my choice.

I'm unhappy with Biden but not enough to vote Green.

by Cee on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 10:16:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
  Wow I'm happy about this, its a solid ticket. Now all thats left is to see what druid or luddite McCain chooses. Can you say "seeing stones."

"We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals; now we know that it is bad economics;" - Franklin Delano Roosevelt
by Salunga on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:16:07 AM EST
Ha Ha! It did not sink in until now. Obama with a sense of humor to reassure the sitcom voting block!

"We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals; now we know that it is bad economics;" - Franklin Delano Roosevelt
by Salunga on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 06:34:26 AM EST
I think it's a good choice. I never got me text message, though...Damn you, Verizon!!!!!! LOL
by conglomerNation on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:26:51 AM EST
That Barack, telling me he would always listen to me, always fight for me, and then what?
No text message either...sigh.
by CabinGirl on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:51:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I got mine at 3:32 AM and have been awake ever since.  Grrr....

"Don't waste your time on the clowns, watch the real show"
by Second Nature on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:52:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I guess he likes you better...
by CabinGirl on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 09:21:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Mr. Objectivity Ron Fournier tries to set the narrative early - Obama lacks confidence.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080823/ap_on_el_pr/veepstakes_analysis

by RollaMO on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 08:35:23 AM EST
First, he's arrogant and presumptive and NOW he lacks confidence?

Well, I know Cindy's money will make sure Ron's checks won't bounce.

The rest of the village is cool with it, and thinks it's a good selection. Damn, I could see it on their faces. Well, gotta play the game.

I also forgot that Biden's from Scranton, PA, unions love him and his wife teaches. And both Obama and Biden are relative paupers in the Millionaire's Club known as the Senate. Biden takes Amtrak home on the weekends.

This is gonna be OK. Those still fellating McSame will continue to do so.

Presumptuous is the new uppity.

by AP on Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 at 09:44:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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