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Paternalistic Analogy

by BooMan
Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 06:44:20 PM EST

Joe Klein is right. I'm trying to think of the right analogy to use that would explain the United States relationship with Iran's reformers. It's kind of like a father who, through the mistreatment of his children, is court-ordered to have nothing to do with them. And then that father sees that his children are in need of help but is prohibited from offering a helping hand.

Friends and acquaintances, seeing the situation, encourage the father to take some action, but the father knows he is powerless to get involved.

The reason I choose this analogy is not because the Iranian reformers are children and Americans are some paternalistic figures that loom over them. But, that is how so many Americans look at the world, that the analogy makes sense. John McCain has such an ingrained neo-colonialist mindset, that you have to talk to him in terms he can understand. He's the father who beat his children and forfeited the right even to treat them well in the future.

America can quietly root for the reformers from a distance, while ruing their prior mistakes that make it impossible to be trusted to help.

With Iran, our credibility is shot.

Paternalistic Analogy | 24 comments (24 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

We're not their father.
The ones urging US action are not our friends or acquaintances.
There was no court order.

Terrible analogy.

Try something more like Bonnie and Clyde, seeing that too many banks are being robbed and wishing they could help, but they're on the lam and would be quite rightly dragged to the hangin' tree if they tried.

FDR's response to progressive demands: "I agree. Now go out and make me do it."

by DaveW on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 07:11:24 PM EST

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

the analogy is for McCain's benefit. And people like McCain.

by BooMan on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 07:23:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Except McCain wouldn't see any mistreatment or other fault. He'd see a need for even more tough love.

FDR's response to progressive demands: "I agree. Now go out and make me do it."

by DaveW on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 07:53:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

It was a perfect analogy. Loved it.

"If you look for the social economic motive, you will not have to wait for history to tell you what was propaganda and what was truth." - George Seldes

by Real History Lisa (lpeaseRemoveThis@gte.net) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:01:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

How about the drunken frat boy who ran through several co-eds with roofies now finds himself on the sex offender registry, and even though a sorority house is on fire he can't come within 500 yards of it.

The Underground Railroad

by Oscar In Louisville on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 07:17:16 PM EST

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

that works, too.

by BooMan on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 07:22:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Yes!

by Bob In Pacifica on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 08:59:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

Remind me again, why isn't the frat-rat in jail?

Well done.

by keres on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:49:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (4.00 / 2)

The CIA won't release the documents.

by Bob In Pacifica on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 11:05:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

thanks BooMan for that link

I'm still getting over my gag reflex at reading "Joe Klein is right", considering how many years he spent being mostly wrong. But this time he's dead on, and it's one of the clearest and truest things I've read in the msm in a long while.

The Four Horsemen of Bushism: War, Corruption, Hypocrisy and Greed

by esquimaux (esquimaux1 at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 08:32:58 PM EST

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

Anyone else tired of this shit?

by BooMan on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 08:33:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

How's the pipeline coming?

by Bob In Pacifica on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:00:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Oh, yeah! Forty Years ago.

by The Voice In The Wilderness on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:02:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

Yeah, I'm tired of this shit, damned tired. In Nam it was Agent Orange and napalm and now it is white phosphorous. And, who suffers the most but the kids? And who will end up losing the whole shebang but the insensitive, amoral, stupid, ugly Americans. And, Bush & co wondered why people hate us so. It's cuz we are moral reprobates, hypocrites to the max and a clear and constant danger to anyone who disagrees with us or has some precious resource that we need to fuel this dangerous addiction we have to consume products.

I think future generations, if there are any, may regard us as the ultimate terrorist nation; one toxic to the well being of the planet itself. I think, perhaps, Armageddon will bear the stamp, "Made in America."

Suppose you scrub your ethical skin until it shines, but inside there is no music, then what? Kabir

by Dongi 2 on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 11:01:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

Terribly terribly tired.

I happened to be in a bookstore yesterday. Not really to buy anything, because I'm already reading at least a half-dozen books. I happened on Dexter Filkins' "The Forever War," and having just finished Jane Mayer's "The Dark Side," I wasn't sure I was ready for another harrowing journey.

Well, the upshot is that I couldn't put the Filkins book down, and ended up taking it home. It is horrifying and riveting, beautifully written and compelling. And I feel such deep sorrow for the Afghan people, especially the women and children. I found myself reexamining my opposition to our presence in Afghanistan. Not out of any fear of terrorism or the drug trade or because I harbor any imperialist or colonialist tendencies, but because I feel such a sense of obligation to these people who have suffered so much. And then I heard about the sentences to be carried out in Somalia, and then I thought about all the places in the world where landmines kill and cripple people every day, and then I thought about all the companies that manufacture landmines and that they employ people who assemble these destructive devices in order to earn money to feed and clothe and shelter their families.

So yes, yes, I'm terribly terribly tired.

by Mum on Wed Jun 24th, 2009 at 07:05:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Absolutely. And what about the disclaimer "some people might find disturbing?" Who in hell wouldn't find that story and photos disturbing? Someone who should be sequestered from society.

by Heart of the Rockies on Wed Jun 24th, 2009 at 09:07:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

esquimaux,
I think you'll find that Joe Klein has been telling the truth about a lot of things for the past year. Unlike most of the pundits, he finally got pissed off and started telling it lke it is.

by priscianus jr on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 08:57:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

thanks, I know people have talked about his shift back toward reality for a while, but I still haven't made a habit of reading Joe.

The Four Horsemen of Bushism: War, Corruption, Hypocrisy and Greed

by esquimaux (esquimaux1 at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:09:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

This is so sickening. And so typical. Burn 'em half to death, and then fix 'em up a little and pretend you're there to help them. We've seen that in Iraq a million times over.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:05:21 PM EST

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Sorry - that was supposed to be a reply to BooMan's link.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 09:05:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

Paragraph 3 should have been paragraph 1, with some minor modifications.

by iamwil on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 10:07:03 PM EST

Paternalistic Analogy (none / 1)

our credibility is shot pretty much world wide, especially in the ME.

thanks to the neoCON misadventures of the past 8 years and decades of fucking around where we shouldn't.

eventually you have to pay the piper, and the debts have just started to come due.

the revolution will not be televised...

by dada on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 10:32:37 PM EST

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

The neocons, et al. put a giant spotlight on what the U.S. has been doing in the world for, as you said, decades, making it very difficult for people to pretend they just didn't know. That just might turn out to be the upside to the last eight catastrophic years. It might be the silver lining around that huge, dark cloud.

by Hurria (Muslawia@gmail.com) on Wed Jun 24th, 2009 at 01:20:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Paternalistic Analogy (none / 0)

McCaniac Response

So... you're saying this is all the trial-lawyers fault. Damn gubmint restraining orders violating my rights and treating me like a criminal just cuz i broke some laws... presnit said I could anyway so it wuzn't wrrong.

damned socialist trial lawyers... I oughta sue em....

/McCainiac response

Join Soulforce-seeking Justice for God's GLBT children.

by its simple IF you ignore the complexity (simplecomplexity AT mac.com) on Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 at 11:40:13 PM EST

Paternalistic Analogy | 24 comments (24 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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